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Vinny · 06-29-2004, 01:22 PM

I love rock, and I don't listen to rap much, but I like a few artists, mainly old school like Run-DMC (seems to be one of the few that rock heads like), although Kanye West seems pretty good.

It is true that rock is based mainly on 3 instruments, with rare variations. This is why I never listen to the hot new band with their new hit repeating 3-power-chord progression song, whose bass player plays the same note 16 times before changing to another note 16 times, then playing another note 16 times, then going back to the start *COUGHTheStrokesCOUGH*.

However, you can't start critcizing rock for its lack of true musicianship when rap isn't exactly renowned for its instrumental value... All that rap tends to be is a recorded and repeating beat that requires no musical talent to play because, well, it isn't actually played. The interesting and contrasting thing between every genre is that they put emphasis on different things; rap emphasizes lyrics and delivery of lyrics, while rock emphasizes musicianship - at least talented rock does. If not, why is the guitar solo such a focal part of rock music? As a musician, I prefer rock because it gives me something to listen to rather than the same repeating pattern. For example, even now, after having listened to "One Hot Minute" by the Red Hot Chili Peppers so many times, every now and then if I'm listening very closely I notice some tiny detail that the guitarist or bassist or drummer decided to throw in that's incongruent with the rest of the song. And that's what humans can give you that machines never will - variation and improvisation. In a machine it'll always be the same pattern playing, while if it's a human player, he might be bored of playing the same riff constantly and, acting upon impulse, decide to do things a little differently that just makes the song that much more special to those who have the musical ear that allows them to listen beyond the singer and the guitar solos. That's something that you simply can't get in rap unless you have actual MUSICIANS playing, which is something that I've yet to see in any rap group. Find me ANY rap group that has musicians that actually play (and I don't mean on one track in the whole album) in it, and I'd be very eager to listen to them. Of course, you could say that Rage Against the Machine has already done that. Rap completely shifts the rhythm section aside to make room for the melody, while in rock the melody is more like the icing on the cake.

Still, you can take rap to a higher level of musicianship even if you have the restriction of a repeating rhythm pattern in the background. This is in terms of delivery of lyrics. If you listen to Eminem - and yes, I do think Eminem is a good rapper, no matter what everyone else says. Just because he's grossly overplayed doesn't mean he's bad - you'll see that the phrasing he uses isn't in the same monotonous tone that gets on your nerves *COUGHDiplomatsCOUGH*, he also uses triplets as well as normal notes. And that's what separates a good rapper from a bad rapper - not only what they say, but how they say it. Even if they're not aware of what they're doing musically, it's their subconscious way of thinking that matters, and that's why talent is necessary to be a good rapper.

... But I still prefer rock [img]tongue.gif[/img] .

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Quote of the week:
"Liz, women are easy. State capitals are hard!" - Bart Simpson.

Pointless fact of the week:
On an American one-dollar bill, there is an owl in the upper left-hand corner of the "1" encased in the "shield" and a spider hidden in the front upper right-hand corner.

06-29-2004, 01:22 PM	#46
Vinny Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: The Fletcher Memorial Home for incurable tyrants and kings Posts: 7,262 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Points: 16,818.86 Bank: 500.00 Total Points: 17,318.86 Donate	I love rock, and I don't listen to rap much, but I like a few artists, mainly old school like Run-DMC (seems to be one of the few that rock heads like), although Kanye West seems pretty good. It is true that rock is based mainly on 3 instruments, with rare variations. This is why I never listen to the hot new band with their new hit repeating 3-power-chord progression song, whose bass player plays the same note 16 times before changing to another note 16 times, then playing another note 16 times, then going back to the start COUGHTheStrokesCOUGH. However, you can't start critcizing rock for its lack of true musicianship when rap isn't exactly renowned for its instrumental value... All that rap tends to be is a recorded and repeating beat that requires no musical talent to play because, well, it isn't actually played. The interesting and contrasting thing between every genre is that they put emphasis on different things; rap emphasizes lyrics and delivery of lyrics, while rock emphasizes musicianship - at least talented rock does. If not, why is the guitar solo such a focal part of rock music? As a musician, I prefer rock because it gives me something to listen to rather than the same repeating pattern. For example, even now, after having listened to "One Hot Minute" by the Red Hot Chili Peppers so many times, every now and then if I'm listening very closely I notice some tiny detail that the guitarist or bassist or drummer decided to throw in that's incongruent with the rest of the song. And that's what humans can give you that machines never will - variation and improvisation. In a machine it'll always be the same pattern playing, while if it's a human player, he might be bored of playing the same riff constantly and, acting upon impulse, decide to do things a little differently that just makes the song that much more special to those who have the musical ear that allows them to listen beyond the singer and the guitar solos. That's something that you simply can't get in rap unless you have actual MUSICIANS playing, which is something that I've yet to see in any rap group. Find me ANY rap group that has musicians that actually play (and I don't mean on one track in the whole album) in it, and I'd be very eager to listen to them. Of course, you could say that Rage Against the Machine has already done that. Rap completely shifts the rhythm section aside to make room for the melody, while in rock the melody is more like the icing on the cake. Still, you can take rap to a higher level of musicianship even if you have the restriction of a repeating rhythm pattern in the background. This is in terms of delivery of lyrics. If you listen to Eminem - and yes, I do think Eminem is a good rapper, no matter what everyone else says. Just because he's grossly overplayed doesn't mean he's bad - you'll see that the phrasing he uses isn't in the same monotonous tone that gets on your nerves COUGHDiplomatsCOUGH, he also uses triplets as well as normal notes. And that's what separates a good rapper from a bad rapper - not only what they say, but how they say it. Even if they're not aware of what they're doing musically, it's their subconscious way of thinking that matters, and that's why talent is necessary to be a good rapper. ... But I still prefer rock [img]tongue.gif[/img] . ----------------------------------------------------------------- Quote of the week: "Liz, women are easy. State capitals are hard!" - Bart Simpson. Pointless fact of the week: On an American one-dollar bill, there is an owl in the upper left-hand corner of the "1" encased in the "shield" and a spider hidden in the front upper right-hand corner.