Attention: Evidence that Zero Mission cannot possibly be Metroid 1's remake!

[Codiekitty]

Methinks that because anybody can edit a Wikipedia page, Dai Grepher put his bull**** on there, because it sounds exactly like his writing.

Also...

Originally posted by Dai Grepher:
Wikipedia is not a canon source of information. Their resources are fansites, and most of the fansites have the storyline wrong to begin with. I have only found a few articles and sites that have the correct timeline of Zero Mission taking place before Metroid.

Where are these lemmings going? The Super Nintendo Super Shire! Hop in line and follow them there!

[Jonathan Resop]

Hahaha. Yeah, he's the one editing Wikipedia. The IPs match. What an idiot! Hahaha! This is classic. I would ban this person, but he's just so damn funny.-jay

[Chunky Kong12345]

He was funny about 10 pages ago. Now it's just annoying.

[Alucard]

Dai Grepher, if you're trying to convince me that you are right, stop. It will never work. I know what I know, and what I know is the truth from reliable sources. You are an idiot for not listening to, ignoring, or twisting the meaning of those sources

Found on Zero Mission page at Wikipedia:
Retcons
Spoiler warning: Plot and/or ending details follow.
Metroid: Zero Mission contains a number of definite or perceived retcons to the Metroid storyline. First and foremost are the differences in the appearance of areas shared directly with Super Metroid. These include the area of original Brinstar where the player begins this game, the escape shaft and Mother Brain's chamber in Tourian, and various areas in Crateria.

A significant possible retcon involves the Space Pirate Mothership and Chozodia, areas which Samus explores at the end of this game. In Super Metroid, there was a Wrecked Ship located at approximately the same location on Zebes, but the manual and other sources stated that this ship was left by cosmonauts who crash-landed on the planet in the distant past. In addition, the ruins of Chozodia are not present in Super Metroid, nor is there enough apparent room for them between Crateria and the Wrecked Ship. The Space Pirate Mothership contains a number of characteristics apparently meant to identify it with the Wrecked Ship, including the canister-shaped workbots found in several rooms. There are many possible explanations to avoid retcons here, but all are fan conjecture.

In this game, Kraid is as large as he was in Super Metroid. It had previously been assumed by most fans that Kraid's increase in size in the latter game was due to some type of genetic engineering. In addition, this game contains no decoy "Fake Kraid," which is a departure from a short but celebrated tradition.

Likewise, it had previously been assumed that Samus Aran's arsenal and skills had increased in complexity over time. Zero Mission now shows us that Samus has been using the same types of suit powerups with all of their abilities since the beginning.

Zero Mission establishes as a fact in the series that the Chozo once lived on Zebes and that Samus was raised there as a child. These details had never been explicitly mentioned in games themselves before, but had been revealed in various other materials, such as the manual for Metroid Prime and the Nintendo Power comic series.

this bunch of data sounds oddly like the info that Dai Grepher was pushing on us earlier in this topic. Apperently, someone didn't read the E-Manga. It clearly stated that Samus was raised on Zebes by the Chozo.

Another thing: it states that there is no remanant of the Chozodian Ruins in SM. when the space pirate mothership blew up, it destroyed most of the ruins and what was left was sealed off from any entry. That is a highly plausable theory to explain this absence.

[ July 08, 2005, 08:15 PM: Message edited by: Lycos ]

[Dai Grepher]

You cannot ban me because I have not broken the user agreement.
I did edit those pages, and that was to show that Wikipedia is unreliable. If anyone can change it, then anyone could post false information on there at any time. Like the theory that Zero Mission is a remake of Metroid for example.

[Jonathan Resop]

I can ban whoever I want for any reason I want whenever I want.-jay

[Chunky Kong12345]

Even though it doesn't say you can be banned for stupidity in the User Agreement, you still can be.

[Jonathan Resop]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Metroid:_Zero_Mission

Haha...Dai got pawned by the Wikipedia people.-jay [img]graemlins/lol.gif[/img]

[Chunky Kong12345]

Sure did.

[Glyph Phoenix]

He keeps talking. Why does he keep talking?

He's clearly wrong. He has nothing even mildy intelligent to support his claims. We told him that. He should know that.

Why does he keep talking? Why?

[The Missing Link]

Captain's Log: Year 2835 of the Cosmic Calendar, July 9

I have returned from my mission out in deep space. The mission was entitled Zero Mission by the folks at HQ because it was my thirty-fifth mission but just so happened to be so damn identical to my first ever mission that they thought it would be be apropos to the situation.

Okay, sorry, I just had to get my kick in. Strike that from the log. The mission was properly entitled Thirty-Four Mission (since the counting is zero-based, of course).

The Grepher Cube remains, but battlestations from all over the galaxy have come into our quadrant to destroy it. The Wikipedia Alliance has joined with the forces of the VGF Quadrant, and so far our attacks have made significant success. His recent escapades, from the reports of other officers, have listed that he tried to replicate himself through a wormhole in hyperspace in order to achieve his conquest of the system, but in doing so, the process backfired, and half of his ship exploded drastically in a magnificent explosion. I wish I had been there to see it.

Anyways, the Cube is now at half power; however, it shows no signs of fading. Chief Science Officer Malcom has ran a diagnostic of the Cube's inhabitants. It seems that there is only one entity aboard the ship, or at least only a single consciousness, and it shows no mental alteration despite this interspatial mishap. Chief Science Officer Malcom has concluded that the Grepher Cube consciousness is insusceptible to pain and deterioration, that despite grave losses to its crew and its faulty proof engines, it still maintains its single collective thought to conquer the world despite the fact that it has rendered itself incapable of doing that.

Malcolm says this is amazing. I say it's utter foolishness.

Captain Link of The Golden Spirit, out.

*** END LOG ***


"There are some who call me... Link?"
"Carpe Gaium Domesticum!" (Seize the Cucco!)
Zelda: The Grand Adventures | Triforce MUCK
ザ行方不明リンク
悪いユウモアの賢人

[Alucard]

If we could just reverse the polarity on the "Grepher Cube" then we could show the "consciousness" our point of view and how wrong it is.

[Dai Grepher]

Yes, wow, one person at a website that anyone can change at any time disagreed with me, I sure did get "pwned".
All that remains is to convince that one person that it is a prequel, since he is the one that keeps reverting the articles back to their incorrect status.
You should also know that none of you were able to bring up anything to disprove the fact that Zero Mission is not a remake, and that there are many other web and review sites, as well as individuals, that believe Zero Mission to be a prequel. I am not the only person in the world that thinks this.

[ July 09, 2005, 09:26 AM: Message edited by: Dai Grepher ]

[Dai Grepher]

Lycos: Dai Grepher, if you're trying to convince me that you are right, stop. It will never work. I know what I know, and what I know is the truth from reliable sources. You are an idiot for not listening to, ignoring, or twisting the meaning of those sources

Dai Grepher: What you think you know is actually wrong. I am right about this issue and the facts prove this. However, I am not trying to convince you. I am just trying to bring true information to the Metroid fans. If they deny the facts and wish to believe a delusion that is incorrect then it is their problem, not mine.

Lycos: this bunch of data sounds oddly like the info that Dai Grepher was pushing on us earlier in this topic. Apperently, someone didn't read the E-Manga. It clearly stated that Samus was raised on Zebes by the Chozo.

Dai Grepher: What does the E-Manga have to do with anything? Anyway, I am sure that the "retcon" information was added to the article after I had already posted that information in other forums. Then after reading my evidence someone edited Wikipedia to explain it all as a "retcon". Now what you should realize is that whoever posted that information about "retconing" Metroid gave no sources as to how they knew it was a "retcon" and not the details of a new and different game. Therefore, the theory that Metroid was "retconed" is just a hypothesis with no evidence to support it. It is merely an excuse to get around the fact that Zero Mission cannot lead into Super Metroid. A most pitiful deception, really.

[quote][qb]Lycos: Another thing: it states that there is no remanant of the Chozodian Ruins in SM. when the space pirate mothership blew up, it destroyed most of the ruins and what was left was sealed off from any entry. That is a highly plausable theory to explain this absence.

Dai Grepher: Or the true and factual explanation that Chozodia and the Ruins were not thought up yet by the writers in 1991, and the in-game explanation that Super Metroid's structure just doesn't lead to those areas even though they could still exist there.
The point is, you are accepting this person's theory as a likely possibility when that person has no proof or evidence to support the claim. The fact that you accept a baseless theory that fits your ideal timeline while rejecting a fact that has proof to back it up because it doesn't fit your ideal timeline proves that you are biased. You ignore the facts because they prove you wrong, not because the facts or I are at fault.

[Chunky Kong12345]

What Nintendo says goes. Now someone lock this topic and ban him.

[Jonathan Resop]

Originally posted by Dai Grepher:
I am not the only person in the world that thinks this.

No, you are. And if anyone else does believe you, then they are simply idiots as well.

The problem with your retarded theory that Zero Mission was meant to be a remake of Metroid's "Gameplay" is that the gameplay in Zero Mission is nothing like the gameplay in Metroid. If anything, the gameplay is identical to the gameplay in Super Metroid and Fusion.

Plenty of people have offered plenty of proof against your stupid theory, but you simply just ignore them. So why should anyone bother listening to you? All of your "proof" is just speculation anyway. I have read ALL of your posts, and I have not read a SINGLE piece of solid proof that isn't just speculation. All you are doing is complaining about level design (which developers DON'T put that much thought into) and semantics of box and manuel descriptions (which is just retarded).

The main problem with your stupid theory is WHY would the developers of this game PURPOSEFULLY make it a prequel and not a remake and NOT make it ABSOLUTELY CLEAR? WHY would they call it a remake if it isn't a remake? All of your "proof" seems to point to the idea that the developers made the game a prequel by accident, which is just retarded as well. Or maybe all of the "remake" stuff was just an accident by the marketing staff, which also is a retarded answer. Either way, your theory makes no sense.

I just find it amazingly retarded that this guy is seriously THIS obsessed with this stupid theory. I mean, he must have spent a TON to free time to BS this crap together. Doesn't this person have a life at all? I mean, seriously. The only way someone can put together a stupid theory like this is if they do nothing besides sit in their parent's house and play Metroid games 24 hours a day. It's just sad. Dai, I pity you. You are a sad, sad, fool.-jay

[Dai Grepher]

Perrin Aybara: No, you are. And if anyone else does believe you, then they are simply idiots as well.

Dai Grepher: I didn't say that they were all people that believed me. There are people whom I have not talked to that think Zero Mission is a prequel, even though they have not read my presentation.

Perrin Aybara: The problem with your retarded theory that Zero Mission was meant to be a remake of Metroid's "Gameplay" is that the gameplay in Zero Mission is nothing like the gameplay in Metroid. If anything, the gameplay is identical to the gameplay in Super Metroid and Fusion.

Dai Grepher: I did not say that it was a remade copy of Metroid's gameplay, I said that it was based on Metroid's gameplay because that is what Sakamoto said.

Perrin Aybara: Plenty of people have offered plenty of proof against your stupid theory, but you simply just ignore them. So why should anyone bother listening to you? All of your "proof" is just speculation anyway.

Dai Grepher: Ignoring them would be to not respond. I did respond to every on-topic post with evidence that refutes the opinions or speculations of the other side. Saying that my proof is speculation is just your opinion. That is what most people did in this topic. They merely stated their opinions about my presentation, which did not disprove it at all.

Perrin Aybara: I have read ALL of your posts, and I have not read a SINGLE piece of solid proof that isn't just speculation.

Dai Grepher: You either read solid proof or you did not read my posts. Saying that everything that I posted was speculation is false.

Perrin Aybara: All you are doing is complaining about level design (which developers DON'T put that much thought into) and semantics of box and manuel descriptions (which is just retarded).

Dai Grepher: I compared the designs of one area of great importance. My conclusion was based on solid facts.
I also quoted the box and the manual. If one game says that its mission is Samus' first and another says that its game is not then it leaves only one truth.
You, however, make the assumption that the developers did not "put that much thought into" the level design. Do you have evidence that proves what the developers did and did not care about?

Perrin Aybara: The main problem with your stupid theory is WHY would the developers of this game PURPOSEFULLY make it a prequel and not a remake and NOT make it ABSOLUTELY CLEAR?

Dai Grepher: They may have thought that they did. Or perhaps left it vague enough so that the fans could piece it together themselves. The director never came out and said what it was, no matter what you think the game is, so in either case, the developers though they made it clear enough in the game.

Perrin Aybara: WHY would they call it a remake if it isn't a remake?

Dai Grepher: They didn't call it a remake. Nintendo Power did, no argument about that, but since then Nintendo of America has changed their stance on the game. No one that worked on the game has called it a remake, but you don't see me using that as evidence against the notion that it is a remake do you?

Perrin Aybara: All of your "proof" seems to point to the idea that the developers made the game a prequel by accident, which is just retarded as well.

Dai Grepher: Maybe it seems that way to you, but only because you see the map and text inconsistencies as mistakes. What my presentation suggests is that those inconsistencies are intentional because they wanted to make Zero Mission unlike Metroid. That was done so that the one would not be seen as a remake of the other.

Perrin Aybara: Or maybe all of the "remake" stuff was just an accident by the marketing staff, which also is a retarded answer.

Dai Grepher: "All the remake stuff" does not exist. Nintendo.com describes Zero Mission to be a different game both in its review and in its official website. The only time Nintendo ever called it a remake was a while ago in Nintendo Power magazine, which is known to present inaccurate information about many of their games.

Perrin Aybara: I just find it amazingly retarded that this guy is seriously THIS obsessed with this stupid theory. I mean, he must have spent a TON to free time to BS this crap together. Doesn't this person have a life at all? I mean, seriously. The only way someone can put together a stupid theory like this is if they do nothing besides sit in their parent's house and play Metroid games 24 hours a day. It's just sad. Dai, I pity you. You are a sad, sad, fool.-jay

Dai Grepher: That would not offend me even if it did apply to me.
The entire presentation only took about two hours to create.

[Chunky Kong12345]

Get a life.

[Jonathan Resop]

Hm, let's quote a few things from that interview you posted.

"at the same time, retell the story of Samus' original mission."

Gee. Explain to me again how Zero Mission can be a prequel if it is a retelling? How can it be retold if it has never been told before? When has it been told before? Oh wait, they're talking about the original Metroid.

"Q: Metroid Zero Mission is the first remake in the Metroid series, and the most significant addition is the addition of cinematics. Do you see this as a trend in adventure games today, the need for a more fleshed-out storyline?

A: Yes I am noticing trends to that extent. It's important to have a story to complement the game, and working on the story, in a game like Metroid that doesn't use a lot of language, it can be very difficult to convey the plot accurately and in a way that the player can understand. This time, the one thing we tried to do was, while fleshing out the story with cinematic scenes we retained a certain amount of mystery to the story in order to maintain the player's interest. I do agree that nowadays in videogames, without a story to go along with it, I think it's difficult for gamers to maintain interest."

Hm, what do you know? They called it a remake! And look! The director himself does not disagree that it is a remake. Don't you think that if the director himself had made the game as a prequel, he would have made it ABSOLUTELY CLEAR during this question that it was NOT a remake?

"Q: In your mind, what has been the greatest challenge in the development of Zero Mission, and how was it overcome?

A: Any time you do a remake there's always the possibility that it could be taken negatively as a mere port other than a truly remade game."

Well gee! Even the director himself calls it a remake! That must be a misunderstanding! SURELY he meant to say "prequel"!

I have now proved to you that Nintendo Power is not the only source that calls it a remake. Not only does IGN call it a remake, but the director himself calls it a reamek. In conclusion, you are a fool.-jay

[CaptHayfever]

Grepher, I knew bloody well that you would go there and edit the article, and that the staff would be on you faster than Adam West on taffy. You proved my point about them discouraging fan theories.

And remember, "I'm-a Luigi, number one!"

[ July 09, 2005, 04:02 PM: Message edited by: CaptHayfever ]