Matrix Revolutions - Page 6 - VGF

imported_AJ Middleton · 11-11-2003, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Prince Toad:
I have Enter the Matrix, but I didn't notice the train man... my brother and I beat it, and he saw the movie (I haven't seen any of the 3), but he didn't mention the train man being in the game. That's the kind of thing he would have mentioned. *shrug*

When Niobe is in the subway station and about to leave via phone, he walks by and says, "Zion only lasted 3 days last time! Hahaha!"

11-12-2003, 12:26 AM

To everybody complaining about how the Neo-Smith fight was too Dragonball Z,

I won't disagree with you because I was honestly thinking the same thing (obviously). However, it makes sense if you think about it. You have two beings with practically limitless power. Why would either one of them hold any of that power back? It wouldn't make any sense if the two of them had a fight where they didn't go entirely ballistic on each other. Now I know somebody's going to go out and say "But Smith didn't go all out on Neo! He only showed about 1/6,000,000,000th of his power!" Well before that happens, I'd like to reiterate the fact that Smith, with they eyes of the oracle, already knew that he was going to win. And we all know that Smith likes to do things the easy way because he's arrogant. So there you go.

Namyar RULES!!!
[Todays date here: Message editied by Namyar]

Don't make me come up there!
\

~Rayman FREAK (Pagemaster of Rayman ULTIMATE)

Lurch1982 · 11-12-2003, 04:02 AM

No, flying and diving is sort of expected when you have two beings in the Matrix that pretty much throw the rules to the shredder, but really...there's a problem with the cinemetography when I (and apparently the rest of the audience) is expecting the next word out of Neo's mouth to be "KAMEHAMEHAAAA!" The whole last fight had sort of a DBZ feel to it...you know, over the top, drawn out, and a very lame ending. I figured when I saw it that Neo dying and then Smith dying came from the equation going from Neo = Smith to 0 = Smith (thus being unbalanced and thus the source fixing it through the blast), but come on: Neo's entire journey of gaining these rediculous powers comes to an end by him getting his ass kicked by an Agent he killed in the first movie who was holding back. Sorry. Stupid ending. The one, as it turns out, sucks.

The whole point of the trilogy was the issue of control (as especially fleshed out in the second one). However, my biggest beef with Revolutions is that it basically IGNORED this entire concept and swept it under the carpet. I mean, Neo never really did find out WHY he was there. Agent Smith only knew he was there to kill Neo. WHY were they all sent running around the Matrix the entire time. They only knew the means, but never the true end or the true reasons.

11-12-2003, 05:02 AM

My friend sent me this:

rev explaination
First off, Neo is able to kill the Machines because he is able to control anything associated with the matrix, and since the machines are, in one way or another, associated with the Matrix he can kill them.
Neo is going to the machine city to make peace with the machine boss. He makes a truse with the boss when he says that he will kill Agent Smith, since he is going out of control and is trying to kill everything and everyone. Neo also promises to give them his body which contains the coding to restart the matrix. He does this in hopes the machines will halt their attack on Zion.
In his battle with Smith. First of all, NEO and SMITH are the same person, when Neo killed smith in the first matrix, part of Neo's code went into Smith and he became Neo's alter ego, in a way. This battle between the two was to prove to everyone that the both of them are unbeatable and that they would fight forever, that is why Neo gives up.
Neo and Smith are the same person as i said before, Neo is supposed to be the Good, or positive side, while Smith is the Bad, or negative side. Since Neo gave up, Smith, who is also the cloned Oracle, freaks out and acts all weird because he can see the future and Neo was not supposed to give up but continue fighting. Smith assumed he was supposed to now clone Neo, he was wrong. The Smith's eventually blow up, this happens because since Neo and Smith are the same person, they cancel each other out. Neo is Positive and Smith is Negative, think of it as 1 plus -1 equals 0, Neo knew this and this is why he gave up, it was the only way to beat Smith.
Now since they are both dead, the machines take Neo's body so they can use his code to restart the Matrix, like he was supposed to do in RELOADED. This time however, since Neo made a truse with the machines Zion would not be destroyed.
When the matrix is rebuilt, the Oracle and the Architect discuss things. She and him agree that the 1% of people that reject the matrix will be allowed to get out and live freely in Zion, and the other 99% who make the CHOICE to stay and live in the matrix, can do so. This is supposed to be the Theory of CHOICE discussed in RELOADED.
THis is supposedly a happy ending in that the people who want to be free can be free and the war between the machines and humans is over.
This is confusing and makes you wonder why the machines just stopped the battle in Zion, but that's the way it is.

Lurch1982 · 11-12-2003, 05:07 PM

And I can sum that entire paragraph up with three words:

Cheap.
Cop.
Out.

imported_mango · 11-12-2003, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lurch1982:
No, its a bad ending because absolutely nothing was explained and everything just seemed thrown together into something that cheapened the entire series.

Exactly. Nothing was explained. Reloaded opened up so many possibilitys and theorys about this and that and whatever and you thought that there could be a matrix inside a matrix and all of these theorys on and on but in the end, they didn't explain anything. Not only did they not answer the questions that we already had, they made more unanswered questions. I don't think I should be walking out of a movie trying to figure out what just happened.

And about the trainstation thing: waste of time. It was just a filler. They could have cut that out of the whole movie and you would understand just as little as you did seeing the whole thing. Oh, and the trainstation is aparently used to smuggle things in and out of the matrix. Well let me ask you this: How the hell do you smuggle a program from the matrix into the real world? And why are there programs in the trainstation? It's not like they were coming from the real world or anything, because they are programs! Again, waste of time.

The battle in zion was pretty cool with the sentinals and the APUs and stuff. Also the battle with bain was cool too.

Okay, about the battle with smith. Personally I thought the fight was pretty cool. Yes, the first thing I thought of when watching it was dragonball Z, but it wasn't necessarily a bad thing. Now the end of the fight is a different story. I don't get it. At all. Yes, when an opposite and a positive go together, they equal nothing. So I guess you are supposed to assume that they both died. Oh and about what the machine put into neo at the end, I think the machine boss guy contacted norton headquarters and downloaded the latest virus definitions and then sent them into neo [img]tongue.gif[/img] So for all of you who are wondering what that was, your answer is here. And with the thing with the oracle lieing on the ground at the end. I didn't get that. If she was lying on the ground, why wasn't eveyone else that agent smith took over on the ground dead too? Oh wait, she was oviously just sleeping because she came back at the end of the movie. Another thing I don't get. And did he die or not? Well at the end you saw in "Neo Vision" when the machine was taking him away, so is that supposed to be a hint that he's still alive?

Okay, so what did we solve here. Oh yeah, nothing. Is there still a matrix? Oh yeah thats still there. Is there still zion? Yeah, that too. Do the machines still rule the world? Let me check... Oh yeah they do that too. So aren't we in the exact same position as at the beginning of the first movie? Why yes, we are.

All in all, I think they should have stopped at the first movie. It was good enough. You understood everything. You walked out happy. Hooray. Sure, you can flame me and tell me how great the movie was and get all protective about it, but this is what I thought, and I know I'm not alone when I say I didn't like the movie.

**Dr. Horrible** · 11-12-2003, 06:44 PM

First of all, I didn't think it was a "cop out" at all. Second, despite common usage, that's a misuse of the phrase "cop out."

Lurch1982 · 11-12-2003, 06:59 PM

eat me.

cop out Phrasal Verb:
To avoid fulfilling a commitment or responsibility; renege.
Example: copped out on my friends; copped out by ducking the issue.

11-12-2003, 07:03 PM

The Matrix is crap.

Debate ended.

**Dr. Horrible** · 11-12-2003, 07:13 PM

George Carlin is cooler than the dictionary any day.=P

11-12-2003, 11:09 PM

I was just reminded of this when somebody was saying it was disliked because all everybody wants to see is a million explosions and don't want to think or feel about the movie.

Isn't this the reason everybody hated HULK?

Where are these lemmings going? The Super Nintendo Super Shire! Hop in line and follow them there!

Lurch1982 · 11-13-2003, 05:23 AM

The Hulk didn't have a story to resolve, didn't have a hype machine running since 1999, and wasn't supposed to be the second coming. And it sucked horribly for a variety of reasons.

11-12-2003, 12:26 AM	#102
ry Guest Posts: n/a Points: 0 Bank: 0 Total Points: 0 Donate	To everybody complaining about how the Neo-Smith fight was too Dragonball Z, I won't disagree with you because I was honestly thinking the same thing (obviously). However, it makes sense if you think about it. You have two beings with practically limitless power. Why would either one of them hold any of that power back? It wouldn't make any sense if the two of them had a fight where they didn't go entirely ballistic on each other. Now I know somebody's going to go out and say "But Smith didn't go all out on Neo! He only showed about 1/6,000,000,000th of his power!" Well before that happens, I'd like to reiterate the fact that Smith, with they eyes of the oracle, already knew that he was going to win. And we all know that Smith likes to do things the easy way because he's arrogant. So there you go. Namyar RULES!!! [Todays date here: Message editied by Namyar] Don't make me come up there! \ ~Rayman FREAK (Pagemaster of Rayman ULTIMATE)

11-12-2003, 04:02 AM	#103
Lurch1982 Senior Member Join Date: May 2000 Location: Katrinaland, USA Gender: Posts: 9,103 Thanks: 119 Thanked 179 Times in 118 Posts Points: 24,526.27 Bank: 128,362.74 Total Points: 152,889.01 Donate	No, flying and diving is sort of expected when you have two beings in the Matrix that pretty much throw the rules to the shredder, but really...there's a problem with the cinemetography when I (and apparently the rest of the audience) is expecting the next word out of Neo's mouth to be "KAMEHAMEHAAAA!" The whole last fight had sort of a DBZ feel to it...you know, over the top, drawn out, and a very lame ending. I figured when I saw it that Neo dying and then Smith dying came from the equation going from Neo = Smith to 0 = Smith (thus being unbalanced and thus the source fixing it through the blast), but come on: Neo's entire journey of gaining these rediculous powers comes to an end by him getting his ass kicked by an Agent he killed in the first movie who was holding back. Sorry. Stupid ending. The one, as it turns out, sucks. The whole point of the trilogy was the issue of control (as especially fleshed out in the second one). However, my biggest beef with Revolutions is that it basically IGNORED this entire concept and swept it under the carpet. I mean, Neo never really did find out WHY he was there. Agent Smith only knew he was there to kill Neo. WHY were they all sent running around the Matrix the entire time. They only knew the means, but never the true end or the true reasons.

11-12-2003, 05:02 AM	#104
Tonberry2k Guest Posts: n/a Points: 0 Bank: 0 Total Points: 0 Donate	My friend sent me this: rev explaination First off, Neo is able to kill the Machines because he is able to control anything associated with the matrix, and since the machines are, in one way or another, associated with the Matrix he can kill them. Neo is going to the machine city to make peace with the machine boss. He makes a truse with the boss when he says that he will kill Agent Smith, since he is going out of control and is trying to kill everything and everyone. Neo also promises to give them his body which contains the coding to restart the matrix. He does this in hopes the machines will halt their attack on Zion. In his battle with Smith. First of all, NEO and SMITH are the same person, when Neo killed smith in the first matrix, part of Neo's code went into Smith and he became Neo's alter ego, in a way. This battle between the two was to prove to everyone that the both of them are unbeatable and that they would fight forever, that is why Neo gives up. Neo and Smith are the same person as i said before, Neo is supposed to be the Good, or positive side, while Smith is the Bad, or negative side. Since Neo gave up, Smith, who is also the cloned Oracle, freaks out and acts all weird because he can see the future and Neo was not supposed to give up but continue fighting. Smith assumed he was supposed to now clone Neo, he was wrong. The Smith's eventually blow up, this happens because since Neo and Smith are the same person, they cancel each other out. Neo is Positive and Smith is Negative, think of it as 1 plus -1 equals 0, Neo knew this and this is why he gave up, it was the only way to beat Smith. Now since they are both dead, the machines take Neo's body so they can use his code to restart the Matrix, like he was supposed to do in RELOADED. This time however, since Neo made a truse with the machines Zion would not be destroyed. When the matrix is rebuilt, the Oracle and the Architect discuss things. She and him agree that the 1% of people that reject the matrix will be allowed to get out and live freely in Zion, and the other 99% who make the CHOICE to stay and live in the matrix, can do so. This is supposed to be the Theory of CHOICE discussed in RELOADED. THis is supposedly a happy ending in that the people who want to be free can be free and the war between the machines and humans is over. This is confusing and makes you wonder why the machines just stopped the battle in Zion, but that's the way it is.

11-12-2003, 05:07 PM	#105
Lurch1982 Senior Member Join Date: May 2000 Location: Katrinaland, USA Gender: Posts: 9,103 Thanks: 119 Thanked 179 Times in 118 Posts Points: 24,526.27 Bank: 128,362.74 Total Points: 152,889.01 Donate	And I can sum that entire paragraph up with three words: Cheap. Cop. Out.

11-12-2003, 06:44 PM	#107
Dr. Horrible PP&R Mod Current Events Mod Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: More important than where is when.... Gender: Posts: 6,304 Thanks: 103 Thanked 272 Times in 171 Posts Points: 1,466.72 Bank: 1,793,477.93 Total Points: 1,794,944.65 Donate	First of all, I didn't think it was a "cop out" at all. Second, despite common usage, that's a misuse of the phrase "cop out."

11-12-2003, 06:59 PM	#108
Lurch1982 Senior Member Join Date: May 2000 Location: Katrinaland, USA Gender: Posts: 9,103 Thanks: 119 Thanked 179 Times in 118 Posts Points: 24,526.27 Bank: 128,362.74 Total Points: 152,889.01 Donate	eat me. cop out Phrasal Verb: To avoid fulfilling a commitment or responsibility; renege. Example: copped out on my friends; copped out by ducking the issue.

11-12-2003, 07:03 PM	#109
Hammer Luigi Guest Posts: n/a Points: 0 Bank: 0 Total Points: 0 Donate	The Matrix is crap. Debate ended.

11-12-2003, 07:13 PM	#110
Dr. Horrible PP&R Mod Current Events Mod Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: More important than where is when.... Gender: Posts: 6,304 Thanks: 103 Thanked 272 Times in 171 Posts Points: 1,466.72 Bank: 1,793,477.93 Total Points: 1,794,944.65 Donate	George Carlin is cooler than the dictionary any day.=P

11-12-2003, 11:09 PM	#111
CodieKitty Guest Posts: n/a Points: 0 Bank: 0 Total Points: 0 Donate	I was just reminded of this when somebody was saying it was disliked because all everybody wants to see is a million explosions and don't want to think or feel about the movie. Isn't this the reason everybody hated HULK? Where are these lemmings going? The Super Nintendo Super Shire! Hop in line and follow them there!

11-13-2003, 05:23 AM	#112
Lurch1982 Senior Member Join Date: May 2000 Location: Katrinaland, USA Gender: Posts: 9,103 Thanks: 119 Thanked 179 Times in 118 Posts Points: 24,526.27 Bank: 128,362.74 Total Points: 152,889.01 Donate	The Hulk didn't have a story to resolve, didn't have a hype machine running since 1999, and wasn't supposed to be the second coming. And it sucked horribly for a variety of reasons.