One year and three days ago... - VGF

Sampson1986 · 11-05-2005, 01:56 PM

George W. Bush was elected to a second term as POTUS.

What does everybody think of the job he's done so far in his second term? I think he's done a so-so job this term.

Keep it civil, guys and gals.

GRENTLEMEN · 11-05-2005, 08:17 PM

I'm disgusted by the mediocrity of George Bush as a man - but that's what you need to be elected these days.

Sampson1986 · 11-05-2005, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by The real A.I. is here to stay.:
I'm disgusted by the mediocrity of George Bush as a man - but that's what you need to be elected these days.

Agreed.

Link2000 · 11-06-2005, 04:31 PM

He hasn't really done anything, has he?

Sampson1986 · 11-06-2005, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Link2000:
He hasn't really done anything, has he?

Yes and no. He's done some things, but most of the things he's done aren't going to radically change anything.

Pyropunk · 11-06-2005, 05:43 PM

if you follow the path of history, G-dub is the next president to get assasinated... and by god i hope someone does it soon... the man has no decency, morals, or understanding for his country...

Sampson1986 · 11-06-2005, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pyropunk:
if you follow the path of history, G-dub is the next president to get assasinated... and by god i hope someone does it soon... the man has no decency, morals, or understanding for his country...

Better be on the lookout for those men in black suits...

Decency, morals, and understanding for the country...I can think of only one president in the past forty years that had all three of those characteristics to an exemplary degree. His name was Ronald Reagan. But, anyways...I am neutral towards Bush. He hasn't been the president I thought he would be, but he hasn't been a total screw up either.

Erdawn Il Deus · 11-06-2005, 06:49 PM

I'm fairly confident he's been enough of a screwup to warrant being shot.

**Prince Toad** · 11-06-2005, 09:17 PM

Decency and morals and understanding are nice, but shouldn't the real issue be that he knows how to run a country, and how to deal with foreign powers? This guy isn't your church father, he's the head of the most powerful country (for now) in the world. Obviously Bush is clueless on that front, although he has got a knack for empty theatrics (Mission accomplished!) and just-as-empty metaphors (I have climbed the mighty mountain, and seen the valley below, and it is a valley of peace). Plus this horribly mismanaged war thing. And the unchecked, rampant corruption. So uh, yeah. I'm gonna say he's ****ed up pretty bad.

To be fair, it was mostly the Republican machine that messed everything up so badly. He's just a poor, stupid puppet of that. It's not all his fault.

Sampson1986 · 11-06-2005, 09:48 PM

Whatever Bush's reasons for doing the things he does, I don't think its to cover up a scandal with an intern named Monica.

Bush has done some stupid things while in office, but the fact that the United States still exists means he isn't a total screw up.

Beam Yosho the Drunkard · 11-06-2005, 10:05 PM

I'm still wondering how we're going to pay off the huge deficient. =/

Legion · 11-07-2005, 05:46 AM

I'm just wondering how an ill-advised affair with an intern is anything like as bad as fighting an illegal war halfway round the planet. Although, to be fair, Blair's complicit in that as well.

I quite liked Clinton personally. Well, when his administration wasn't blowing up bloody apirin factories anyway. ¬_¬

***CaptHayfever*** · 11-07-2005, 11:59 AM

There are a lot of things you could call this war that I would in some way agree with: immoral, unethical, idiotic, a huge mistake, a complete botch, flat-out wrong, etc.
But the one I don't get is 'illegal.' Didn't Congress authorize it?

And remember, "I'm-a Luigi, number one!"

Legion · 11-07-2005, 12:47 PM

I believe it was an illegal war as it was not supported or authorised by the UN in any form, resolution or otherwise. The UN has no peacekeeping forces in Iraq. At least in Britain the war was fought without the support of the majority of people, and in fact Blair led us into Iraq on his own little misguided crusade to impress George Bush.

I don't know the actual legal definitions when it comes to the act of actually declaring war, but I believe that it was an illegal action, whether Congress says it was or not.

***CaptHayfever*** · 11-07-2005, 02:48 PM

Well, why on earth would the UN authorize any war?

And remember, "I'm-a Luigi, number one!"

Legion · 11-07-2005, 03:37 PM

Korean War, Bosnia, Kosovo, Second Congo War, etc.

There are more, but I can't remember them off the top of my head, and I need to double-check some of them first. But there are occasions when the UN will use military means to get the results they want. They do have an army, in a loose sense of the word I think, after all. Although, it's not a recommended course of action in any circumstances.

I'm more angry at Blair than Bush. There were massive protests here against Britain entering the war, but the PM didn't listen. if he had, then perhaps Bush would not have had the confidence to go to war alone. Plus he's installed a wealth of new draconian reactionary anti-terror laws, to curtail personal freedoms in some ill-concieved attmept to appear to be doing something following the bombings in London. Bush isn't quite such a problem. At least he needs the support of Congress to take the US to war. Blair can declare war on his own initiative.

PSYCHOKID909 · 11-07-2005, 05:38 PM

Isn't the US of one the major Financers of the UN? I like Bush but I think he could do better, Hell i'd like to see the border situation resloved once and for all. I've nothing agenst emigration provided it's done properly. Also I'd like to see the job market expand abit more, but you never know maybe the meduim security prision being built in my hometown will do it some good.

Nick · 11-08-2005, 01:06 AM

Let's compare the investigations of the last two presidencies: Clinton got harassed by congress for getting his winkey whacked. Bush has a VP chief of staff and possibly Karl Rove indicted for OUTING A CIA AGENT TO SILENCE HER HUSBAND. Morality and high horses do not work with an administration that is the most corrupt one this country has seen since Useless Grant.

Yeah.

This doesn't even get into subsidies for oil companies, an energy policy created behind closed doors by the Enron dip****s, disgusting croneyism--specifically placing a grossly unqualified, resume-lying, friend of his college roommate in the spot of Director of FEMA only to watch said idiot ignore a hurricane exercise conducted the previous year, send cute emails back and forth to his staff while New Orleans decended into Hell, not take control of a situation, and sat on his hands when he wasn't ringing them back and forth while a major US city was demolished and people DIED because the government agency under his control did not administer relief soon enough, the attempted appointment of Myers as a Supreme Court judge, the lack of any sort of accomplishment in either term, the lack of exit plan from Iraq, the lack of exit plan from Afghanastan, the exit from international treaties, the runaway spending that has not been checked in, the open borders he keeps ripping open, the outsourcing, the No Child Left Behind Act which does more to derail educational focus, the USAPatriot Act, the sanctioning of torture, the ignoring of the Geneva Convention, allowing 9/11 to happen because they ignored memos with titles like "Al Qaeda training pilots" and "bin Laden to use planes in attacks," the silent dismanteling of the essential bureocracies in the Federal Government, the whoring out of the FCC and FDA, a declining job market that is constantly losing good positions and shifting over to a society where everyone works in a store or sells insurance to the people that work in the stores, and the 2000+ lives lost in combat in the Middle East.

Sampson1986 · 11-08-2005, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by The Great Tyrant:
Let's compare the investigations of the last two presidencies: Clinton got harassed by congress for getting his winkey whacked. Bush has a VP chief of staff and possibly Karl Rove indicted for OUTING A CIA AGENT TO SILENCE HER HUSBAND. Morality and high horses do not work with an administration that is the most corrupt one this country has seen since Useless Grant.

Yeah.

This doesn't even get into subsidies for oil companies, an energy policy created behind closed doors by the Enron dip****s, disgusting croneyism--specifically placing a grossly unqualified, resume-lying, friend of his college roommate in the spot of Director of FEMA only to watch said idiot ignore a hurricane exercise conducted the previous year, send cute emails back and forth to his staff while New Orleans decended into Hell, not take control of a situation, and sat on his hands when he wasn't ringing them back and forth while a major US city was demolished and people DIED because the government agency under his control did not administer relief soon enough, the attempted appointment of Myers as a Supreme Court judge, the lack of any sort of accomplishment in either term, the lack of exit plan from Iraq, the lack of exit plan from Afghanastan, the exit from international treaties, the runaway spending that has not been checked in, the open borders he keeps ripping open, the outsourcing, the No Child Left Behind Act which does more to derail educational focus, the USAPatriot Act, the sanctioning of torture, the ignoring of the Geneva Convention, allowing 9/11 to happen because they ignored memos with titles like "Al Qaeda training pilots" and "bin Laden to use planes in attacks," the silent dismanteling of the essential bureocracies in the Federal Government, the whoring out of the FCC and FDA, a declining job market that is constantly losing good positions and shifting over to a society where everyone works in a store or sells insurance to the people that work in the stores, and the 2000+ lives lost in combat in the Middle East.

You have some good points there, but two things struck me as downright screwy.

1. Clinton never got harassed because he took his pants down, he got harassed because he lied under oath.

2. I disagree with almost all war(the sole exception is World War II). The war in Iraq has been costly to the US, however I think there has been more accomplished in Iraq than there was in South Vietnam, wouldn't you say?

As I said before, I don't agree with everthing Bush has done. However, I think that being the president of the most powerful nation in the world would be no small task. Add that to the fact that half of his countrymen were against him from the start and what do you have?

It just goes to show that ya can't please everyone.

[ November 08, 2005, 03:39 PM: Message edited by: Sampson1986 ]

Legion · 11-08-2005, 06:30 PM

^^Let's not forget the 25'000-odd civilian casulties from conflicts in the Middle East. And the possible use of chemical weapons against Iraqi civilians.

^It's kind of hard to compare Vietnam and Iraq. In Vietnam you had a situation of the US defending a previously established government from invasion by a hostile power. There were defined borders to that conflict. Perhaps not too clear, but that's what comes of conflict in jungles. In Iraq the US is the occupying power defending a government established by the occupation forces. In the Iraq war there aren't any borders to the fighting, no matter what rhetoric you hear thrown around about 'front-lines' and so forth. It's hard to measure the two on the same terms.

But yes, considering the Iraqi government hasn't collapsed yet, they are doing better than in South Vietnam.

11-05-2005, 01:56 PM	#1
Sampson1986 Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Glacier County, Montana Gender: Posts: 319 Thanks: 4 Thanked 7 Times in 3 Posts Points: 11,148.49 Bank: 563.08 Total Points: 11,711.57 Donate	George W. Bush was elected to a second term as POTUS. What does everybody think of the job he's done so far in his second term? I think he's done a so-so job this term. Keep it civil, guys and gals.

11-05-2005, 08:17 PM	#2
GRENTLEMEN Retro Nintendo Supermod Art & Literature Mod Metroid Mod Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I rub my tilde all over your asterisk Gender: Posts: 15,881 Thanks: 456 Thanked 1,151 Times in 628 Posts Points: 6,364.57 Bank: 1,830,360.28 Total Points: 1,836,724.85 Donate	I'm disgusted by the mediocrity of George Bush as a man - but that's what you need to be elected these days.

11-06-2005, 04:31 PM	#4
Link2000 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Ontario, Canada Gender: Posts: 8,052 Thanks: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Points: 15,800.15 Bank: 804.22 Total Points: 16,604.37 Donate	He hasn't really done anything, has he?

11-06-2005, 05:43 PM	#6
Pyropunk Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: a place that is a grove of cottages, MN Gender: Posts: 104 Thanks: 11 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Points: 2,665.70 Bank: 627.97 Total Points: 3,293.67 Donate	if you follow the path of history, G-dub is the next president to get assasinated... and by god i hope someone does it soon... the man has no decency, morals, or understanding for his country...

11-06-2005, 06:49 PM	#8
Erdawn Il Deus Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Threading the jeweled thrones of earth under my sandalled feet Gender: Posts: 2,983 Thanks: 4 Thanked 45 Times in 39 Posts Points: 22,319.93 Bank: 742.97 Total Points: 23,062.90 Donate	I'm fairly confident he's been enough of a screwup to warrant being shot.

11-06-2005, 09:17 PM	#9
Prince Toad PC Mod Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Rookery Gender: Posts: 11,402 Thanks: 43 Thanked 56 Times in 47 Posts Points: 43,221.57 Bank: 18,304.68 Total Points: 61,526.25 Donate	Decency and morals and understanding are nice, but shouldn't the real issue be that he knows how to run a country, and how to deal with foreign powers? This guy isn't your church father, he's the head of the most powerful country (for now) in the world. Obviously Bush is clueless on that front, although he has got a knack for empty theatrics (Mission accomplished!) and just-as-empty metaphors (I have climbed the mighty mountain, and seen the valley below, and it is a valley of peace). Plus this horribly mismanaged war thing. And the unchecked, rampant corruption. So uh, yeah. I'm gonna say he's ****ed up pretty bad. To be fair, it was mostly the Republican machine that messed everything up so badly. He's just a poor, stupid puppet of that. It's not all his fault.

11-06-2005, 09:48 PM	#10
Sampson1986 Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Glacier County, Montana Gender: Posts: 319 Thanks: 4 Thanked 7 Times in 3 Posts Points: 11,148.49 Bank: 563.08 Total Points: 11,711.57 Donate	Whatever Bush's reasons for doing the things he does, I don't think its to cover up a scandal with an intern named Monica. Bush has done some stupid things while in office, but the fact that the United States still exists means he isn't a total screw up.

11-06-2005, 10:05 PM	#11
Beam Yosho the Drunkard Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: The oversized rock of Hawaii. Gender: Posts: 5,665 Thanks: 5 Thanked 17 Times in 13 Posts Points: 22,452.39 Bank: 500.00 Total Points: 22,952.39 Donate	I'm still wondering how we're going to pay off the huge deficient. =/

11-07-2005, 05:46 AM	#12
Legion Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Greater Mancester, UK Gender: Posts: 1,860 Thanks: 10 Thanked 16 Times in 11 Posts Points: 7,801.29 Bank: 6,647.77 Total Points: 14,449.06 Donate	I'm just wondering how an ill-advised affair with an intern is anything like as bad as fighting an illegal war halfway round the planet. Although, to be fair, Blair's complicit in that as well. I quite liked Clinton personally. Well, when his administration wasn't blowing up bloody apirin factories anyway. ¬_¬

11-07-2005, 11:59 AM	#13
*CaptHayfever* Smash Supermod Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: (n) - the place where I am Gender: Posts: 19,273 Thanks: 160 Thanked 733 Times in 474 Posts Points: 105,385.73 Bank: 923.79 Total Points: 106,309.52 Donate	There are a lot of things you could call this war that I would in some way agree with: immoral, unethical, idiotic, a huge mistake, a complete botch, flat-out wrong, etc. But the one I don't get is 'illegal.' Didn't Congress authorize it? And remember, "I'm-a Luigi, number one!"

11-07-2005, 12:47 PM	#14
Legion Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Greater Mancester, UK Gender: Posts: 1,860 Thanks: 10 Thanked 16 Times in 11 Posts Points: 7,801.29 Bank: 6,647.77 Total Points: 14,449.06 Donate	I believe it was an illegal war as it was not supported or authorised by the UN in any form, resolution or otherwise. The UN has no peacekeeping forces in Iraq. At least in Britain the war was fought without the support of the majority of people, and in fact Blair led us into Iraq on his own little misguided crusade to impress George Bush. I don't know the actual legal definitions when it comes to the act of actually declaring war, but I believe that it was an illegal action, whether Congress says it was or not.

11-07-2005, 02:48 PM	#15
*CaptHayfever* Smash Supermod Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: (n) - the place where I am Gender: Posts: 19,273 Thanks: 160 Thanked 733 Times in 474 Posts Points: 105,385.73 Bank: 923.79 Total Points: 106,309.52 Donate	Well, why on earth would the UN authorize any war? And remember, "I'm-a Luigi, number one!"

11-07-2005, 03:37 PM	#16
Legion Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Greater Mancester, UK Gender: Posts: 1,860 Thanks: 10 Thanked 16 Times in 11 Posts Points: 7,801.29 Bank: 6,647.77 Total Points: 14,449.06 Donate	Korean War, Bosnia, Kosovo, Second Congo War, etc. There are more, but I can't remember them off the top of my head, and I need to double-check some of them first. But there are occasions when the UN will use military means to get the results they want. They do have an army, in a loose sense of the word I think, after all. Although, it's not a recommended course of action in any circumstances. I'm more angry at Blair than Bush. There were massive protests here against Britain entering the war, but the PM didn't listen. if he had, then perhaps Bush would not have had the confidence to go to war alone. Plus he's installed a wealth of new draconian reactionary anti-terror laws, to curtail personal freedoms in some ill-concieved attmept to appear to be doing something following the bombings in London. Bush isn't quite such a problem. At least he needs the support of Congress to take the US to war. Blair can declare war on his own initiative.

11-07-2005, 05:38 PM	#17
PSYCHOKID909 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: On the run. Gender: Posts: 8,270 Thanks: 57 Thanked 30 Times in 26 Posts Points: 3,427.35 Bank: 2,515.05 Total Points: 5,942.40 Donate	Isn't the US of one the major Financers of the UN? I like Bush but I think he could do better, Hell i'd like to see the border situation resloved once and for all. I've nothing agenst emigration provided it's done properly. Also I'd like to see the job market expand abit more, but you never know maybe the meduim security prision being built in my hometown will do it some good.

11-08-2005, 01:06 AM	#18
Nick Banned Join Date: Dec 1969 Posts: 0 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Points: 10,313.00 Bank: 500.00 Total Points: 10,813.00 Donate	Let's compare the investigations of the last two presidencies: Clinton got harassed by congress for getting his winkey whacked. Bush has a VP chief of staff and possibly Karl Rove indicted for OUTING A CIA AGENT TO SILENCE HER HUSBAND. Morality and high horses do not work with an administration that is the most corrupt one this country has seen since Useless Grant. Yeah. This doesn't even get into subsidies for oil companies, an energy policy created behind closed doors by the Enron dip****s, disgusting croneyism--specifically placing a grossly unqualified, resume-lying, friend of his college roommate in the spot of Director of FEMA only to watch said idiot ignore a hurricane exercise conducted the previous year, send cute emails back and forth to his staff while New Orleans decended into Hell, not take control of a situation, and sat on his hands when he wasn't ringing them back and forth while a major US city was demolished and people DIED because the government agency under his control did not administer relief soon enough, the attempted appointment of Myers as a Supreme Court judge, the lack of any sort of accomplishment in either term, the lack of exit plan from Iraq, the lack of exit plan from Afghanastan, the exit from international treaties, the runaway spending that has not been checked in, the open borders he keeps ripping open, the outsourcing, the No Child Left Behind Act which does more to derail educational focus, the USAPatriot Act, the sanctioning of torture, the ignoring of the Geneva Convention, allowing 9/11 to happen because they ignored memos with titles like "Al Qaeda training pilots" and "bin Laden to use planes in attacks," the silent dismanteling of the essential bureocracies in the Federal Government, the whoring out of the FCC and FDA, a declining job market that is constantly losing good positions and shifting over to a society where everyone works in a store or sells insurance to the people that work in the stores, and the 2000+ lives lost in combat in the Middle East.

11-08-2005, 06:30 PM	#20
Legion Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Greater Mancester, UK Gender: Posts: 1,860 Thanks: 10 Thanked 16 Times in 11 Posts Points: 7,801.29 Bank: 6,647.77 Total Points: 14,449.06 Donate	^^Let's not forget the 25'000-odd civilian casulties from conflicts in the Middle East. And the possible use of chemical weapons against Iraqi civilians. ^It's kind of hard to compare Vietnam and Iraq. In Vietnam you had a situation of the US defending a previously established government from invasion by a hostile power. There were defined borders to that conflict. Perhaps not too clear, but that's what comes of conflict in jungles. In Iraq the US is the occupying power defending a government established by the occupation forces. In the Iraq war there aren't any borders to the fighting, no matter what rhetoric you hear thrown around about 'front-lines' and so forth. It's hard to measure the two on the same terms. But yes, considering the Iraqi government hasn't collapsed yet, they are doing better than in South Vietnam.