9/11 a hoax by the governent to make money? - VGF

joe_brown · 05-06-2006, 10:22 PM

There is a video called loose change and it explains a lot of points that make me belive Sept. 11 was a hoax to get:
~Control of the middle east
~Oil
~A reason to start a war

www.loosechange911.com has the video on there. You can download it, i suggest you watch it, i cant explain everything here.

Lurch1982 · 05-06-2006, 11:35 PM

These guys get an F in site design. It takes way to long to load anything (yes, I'm even using Mozilla, so it obviously isn't that optimized as it claims).

This is basically the best of the net in terms of conspiracy theories. The entire pentagon argument is debunked at:
http://www.snopes.com/rumors/pentagon.htm

Airline stocks:
http://www.snopes.com/rumors/putcall.asp

Particularly interesting is their (idiotic/misguided) notion that the WTC couldn't collapse due to planes slamming into them. Comparing the B-25 that hit the Empire State building 60 years prior doesn't work because it isn't as large, nor does it hold the same type and amount of fuel as a modern day passenger jet fueled up for a cross-country flight. Essentially what you'd get is intensive napalm burning in the building. Simple physics does the rest. Go play fcucking Jenga and take out some pieces in the middle and see how long the tower stays up. That's basically what happened.

As far as contingency plans, planning for attacks, and using the WTC on internal terrorism documents in the 1990s, that's normal. Think-tanks always spout off swearing is childishswearing is childishswearing is childishswearing is childish like that, and yes, a reworking of the military/defense condition was dependant on a Pearl Harbor style attack. Basic concept. As for WTC images, IT WAS ALREADY HIT IN THE EARLY 1990s. GG, try again.

As far as the "OMG 9/11 = EXCUES TO GETS TEH OILZ!1," it doesn't work unless you're a complete fcuking idiot and think that you can use a shoddy excuse to invade a country and expect the citizens to accept foreign rule with hugs and kisses...oh wait. Well regardless, having access to the oil in the middle east would pretty much require taking over the entire region, which simply isn't feasable. As far as controlling the middle east, I think our foreign policy as of the last 30 years has been one of trying to not get unnecissarily entangled in the middle east because its so volitile.

Yeah, I'm not exactly the biggest fan of the Bush admin, having voted against idiocy for 6 years now, but even I don't believe this bullcrap.

0/10.

joe_brown · 05-07-2006, 01:23 AM

Lol, okay I was just seeing what people here thought. Thanks for the oppinion, i guess..

***Ynot Shane*** · 05-07-2006, 01:17 PM

Interesting video. If nothing else, it gets you to thinking. The simple fact is that if not for 9/11, Bush would no longer be in office. That alone would give the government reason to stage something like this, not to mention the potential gains others would have from something like this. While I wouldn't necessarily suggest that the entire day was a hoax (and wouldn't doubt it either for that matter), there is clearly a great deal of coverup and lying. The American empire is in its decline, and as things get worse, the desperation to hang on (and thus a scenario like this) only becomes more intense, particularly if they can prove Americans are gullible enough to believe that the official story is the truth, which most are.

The Snopes article debunks portions of the Pentagon argument... but not the entire thing. Besides which, in that article, they make no conclusive arguments. They just suggest there's no conclusive arguments to suggest it's true.

By that same logic, the Empire State building wasn't of the same calibur as the twin towers.

While taking over the entire region is a pipe dream, it's abundantly clear that the US government, with full support of its citizens, will do whatever it takes to save a nickel on a gallon of gasoline. We may not all always agree on the methods used, but the end result is of vital interest to the vast majority of the population. If not for oil, we'd have about as much interest in the middle east as we have in Africa. Like we're really doing it for the greater good and to protect the Jews.

Link2000 · 05-07-2006, 07:27 PM

If the US can't cover up somehtign as small as Abu-Grahab, or simply plant some WMDs in Iraq in the first place, how do you expect them to cover-up something as massive as 9/11?

Nojoy · 05-07-2006, 07:51 PM

ya. thats right. 9/11 was a hoax just like JFK was killed by the KGB and Jews rule the world which is really a computer program designed by machines

joe_brown · 05-07-2006, 08:40 PM

Lol @ Nojoy, Yeah, this topic is very interesting, but perhaps they tried to make it look like they covered up Abu-Grahab, when really they weren't trying to, to make you believe that they can't cover anything up. Therefore, you think that they couldn't have possibly covered up 9/11.

A bit confusing, but I still don't know what to believe. Someone convince me!

Lurch1982 · 05-07-2006, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Link2000

If the US can't cover up somehtign as small as Abu-Grahab, or simply plant some WMDs in Iraq in the first place, how do you expect them to cover-up something as massive as 9/11?

Simple numbers. Abu-Grahab had photographic evidence and was at least acknowledged by the garrison stationed there. If there's a meeting between Bush, Cheney, Rice, Rumsfeld, et al., its generally not going to leak out because they'll be the only ones that know about it. Any conspiracy theory would have to involve a small circle, which is why I have serious doubts about the validity of the site's insinuation that the Pentagon had been training for this and a military trained pilot crashed a plane. That would have leaked out by a Pentagon middleman years ago.

Link2000 · 05-08-2006, 05:45 AM

Lurch, your lst point is pretty much what I tried to convey. The 9/11 conspiricy would involve hundreds of people, which just doesn't fit with a secret. People talk.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/scie...e/1227842.html

That one debunks a lot of the scientific arguemnets put forward by the conspiricy theorists.

Nojoy · 05-08-2006, 04:23 PM

uh-huh. 9/11 was a hoax to make money and thats what explains the trillion-dollar debt. yep. that makes sense alright.

***Ynot Shane*** · 05-08-2006, 05:08 PM

Trying to pull off something this big would have its holes no matter how precise. Except most people wouldn't care this late in the game about any conspiracies, and people were too brainwashed by propaganda to care when it may have actually mattered.

mariobrother4839 · 05-13-2006, 03:34 AM

for some reason I don't doubt this.

Beam Yosho the Drunkard · 05-19-2006, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nojoy

uh-huh. 9/11 was a hoax to make money and thats what explains the trillion-dollar debt. yep. that makes sense alright.

Usually, whenever there's any big scandels such as this, it rarely ever favors for the entire country, just a for those who already have more than enough power and money.

Assuming if this whole fiasco is really a scandel, anyways.

Darth_Flava · 05-24-2006, 07:41 PM

Even I though I understand that this was just another attempt to get a reaction out us. I'm still going to post. To think that the government would really kill 3000 people just so they could have a reason to invade an oil rich nation is one of the lamest excuses of a thread. Sure oil is always going to be a reason to try to get into a country, but anyone who believes this bull**** really needs to get a life.

Legion · 05-25-2006, 07:37 AM

9/11 was a hoax? Rather than, you know, a set-up, which I think is what you're getting at?

Princess Zelda of Hyrule · 08-28-2006, 10:48 PM

I might have considered that conspiracy theory had I not known how viciously people hate Bush. They hate him enough to step on the dead and the bereaved as their soapbox.

**Prince Toad** · 08-28-2006, 11:38 PM

That shouldn't affect your reaction. Don't consider the theory because it's fallacious, not because people hate Bush.

Koga · 08-29-2006, 04:09 AM

It's really much more likely that the US government knew something like this was going to happen and didn't act on it, than that they did so themselves. Not that I believe either.

Princess Zelda of Hyrule · 08-29-2006, 11:35 AM

It affects my reaction because I highly, highly, highly suspect someone's got a not-so-productive agenda. Our country gets attacked and all our people can do is recognize another opportunity for left versus right.

**Prince Toad** · 08-29-2006, 08:15 PM

^^Well, there was that little memo that said "Bin Laden Determined To Attack Inside United States" or whatever. So yeah, they might've had a little hint. I guess they didn't have full details or anything, no.

05-06-2006, 10:22 PM	#1
joe_brown Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Gender: Posts: 1,644 Thanks: 11 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts Points: 6,983.39 Bank: 0.00 Total Points: 6,983.39 Donate	9/11 a hoax by the governent to make money? There is a video called loose change and it explains a lot of points that make me belive Sept. 11 was a hoax to get: ~Control of the middle east ~Oil ~A reason to start a war www.loosechange911.com has the video on there. You can download it, i suggest you watch it, i cant explain everything here.

05-07-2006, 01:17 PM	#4
*Ynot Shane* Not Ready to Make Nice Join Date: Apr 1999 Location: Flaflooga Gender: Posts: 131,257 Thanks: 38 Thanked 405 Times in 209 Posts Points: 171,786.57 Bank: 10,977,010.54 Total Points: 11,148,797.10 Donate	Interesting video. If nothing else, it gets you to thinking. The simple fact is that if not for 9/11, Bush would no longer be in office. That alone would give the government reason to stage something like this, not to mention the potential gains others would have from something like this. While I wouldn't necessarily suggest that the entire day was a hoax (and wouldn't doubt it either for that matter), there is clearly a great deal of coverup and lying. The American empire is in its decline, and as things get worse, the desperation to hang on (and thus a scenario like this) only becomes more intense, particularly if they can prove Americans are gullible enough to believe that the official story is the truth, which most are. The Snopes article debunks portions of the Pentagon argument... but not the entire thing. Besides which, in that article, they make no conclusive arguments. They just suggest there's no conclusive arguments to suggest it's true. By that same logic, the Empire State building wasn't of the same calibur as the twin towers. While taking over the entire region is a pipe dream, it's abundantly clear that the US government, with full support of its citizens, will do whatever it takes to save a nickel on a gallon of gasoline. We may not all always agree on the methods used, but the end result is of vital interest to the vast majority of the population. If not for oil, we'd have about as much interest in the middle east as we have in Africa. Like we're really doing it for the greater good and to protect the Jews. __________________ A bird in the hand will just keep pecking and pecking and pecking and pecking... until your hand starts to bleed.

05-08-2006, 04:23 PM	#10
Nojoy Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Wouldn't you like to know Gender: Posts: 90 Thanks: 2 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Points: 1,955.66 Bank: 500.00 Total Points: 2,455.66 Donate	uh-huh. 9/11 was a hoax to make money and thats what explains the trillion-dollar debt. yep. that makes sense alright. Last edited by Nojoy; 05-08-2006 at 04:32 PM.

05-08-2006, 05:08 PM	#11
*Ynot Shane* Not Ready to Make Nice Join Date: Apr 1999 Location: Flaflooga Gender: Posts: 131,257 Thanks: 38 Thanked 405 Times in 209 Posts Points: 171,786.57 Bank: 10,977,010.54 Total Points: 11,148,797.10 Donate	Trying to pull off something this big would have its holes no matter how precise. Except most people wouldn't care this late in the game about any conspiracies, and people were too brainwashed by propaganda to care when it may have actually mattered. __________________ A bird in the hand will just keep pecking and pecking and pecking and pecking... until your hand starts to bleed.

05-06-2006, 11:35 PM	#2
Lurch1982 Senior Member Join Date: May 2000 Location: Katrinaland, USA Gender: Posts: 9,092 Thanks: 117 Thanked 175 Times in 116 Posts Points: 23,560.73 Bank: 113,982.44 Total Points: 137,543.17 Donate	These guys get an F in site design. It takes way to long to load anything (yes, I'm even using Mozilla, so it obviously isn't that optimized as it claims). This is basically the best of the net in terms of conspiracy theories. The entire pentagon argument is debunked at: http://www.snopes.com/rumors/pentagon.htm Airline stocks: http://www.snopes.com/rumors/putcall.asp Particularly interesting is their (idiotic/misguided) notion that the WTC couldn't collapse due to planes slamming into them. Comparing the B-25 that hit the Empire State building 60 years prior doesn't work because it isn't as large, nor does it hold the same type and amount of fuel as a modern day passenger jet fueled up for a cross-country flight. Essentially what you'd get is intensive napalm burning in the building. Simple physics does the rest. Go play fcucking Jenga and take out some pieces in the middle and see how long the tower stays up. That's basically what happened. As far as contingency plans, planning for attacks, and using the WTC on internal terrorism documents in the 1990s, that's normal. Think-tanks always spout off swearing is childishswearing is childishswearing is childishswearing is childish like that, and yes, a reworking of the military/defense condition was dependant on a Pearl Harbor style attack. Basic concept. As for WTC images, IT WAS ALREADY HIT IN THE EARLY 1990s. GG, try again. As far as the "OMG 9/11 = EXCUES TO GETS TEH OILZ!1," it doesn't work unless you're a complete fcuking idiot and think that you can use a shoddy excuse to invade a country and expect the citizens to accept foreign rule with hugs and kisses...oh wait. Well regardless, having access to the oil in the middle east would pretty much require taking over the entire region, which simply isn't feasable. As far as controlling the middle east, I think our foreign policy as of the last 30 years has been one of trying to not get unnecissarily entangled in the middle east because its so volitile. Yeah, I'm not exactly the biggest fan of the Bush admin, having voted against idiocy for 6 years now, but even I don't believe this bullcrap. 0/10.

05-07-2006, 01:23 AM	#3
joe_brown Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Gender: Posts: 1,644 Thanks: 11 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts Points: 6,983.39 Bank: 0.00 Total Points: 6,983.39 Donate	Lol, okay I was just seeing what people here thought. Thanks for the oppinion, i guess..

05-07-2006, 07:27 PM	#5
Link2000 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Ontario, Canada Gender: Posts: 8,052 Thanks: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Points: 15,481.15 Bank: 804.22 Total Points: 16,285.37 Donate	If the US can't cover up somehtign as small as Abu-Grahab, or simply plant some WMDs in Iraq in the first place, how do you expect them to cover-up something as massive as 9/11?

05-07-2006, 07:51 PM	#6
Nojoy Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Wouldn't you like to know Gender: Posts: 90 Thanks: 2 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Points: 1,955.66 Bank: 500.00 Total Points: 2,455.66 Donate	ya. thats right. 9/11 was a hoax just like JFK was killed by the KGB and Jews rule the world which is really a computer program designed by machines

05-07-2006, 08:40 PM	#7
joe_brown Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Gender: Posts: 1,644 Thanks: 11 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts Points: 6,983.39 Bank: 0.00 Total Points: 6,983.39 Donate	Lol @ Nojoy, Yeah, this topic is very interesting, but perhaps they tried to make it look like they covered up Abu-Grahab, when really they weren't trying to, to make you believe that they can't cover anything up. Therefore, you think that they couldn't have possibly covered up 9/11. A bit confusing, but I still don't know what to believe. Someone convince me!

05-08-2006, 05:45 AM	#9
Link2000 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Ontario, Canada Gender: Posts: 8,052 Thanks: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Points: 15,481.15 Bank: 804.22 Total Points: 16,285.37 Donate	Lurch, your lst point is pretty much what I tried to convey. The 9/11 conspiricy would involve hundreds of people, which just doesn't fit with a secret. People talk. http://www.popularmechanics.com/scie...e/1227842.html That one debunks a lot of the scientific arguemnets put forward by the conspiricy theorists.

05-13-2006, 03:34 AM	#12
mariobrother4839 Newbie Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: lepanto arkansas Posts: 2 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Points: 570.00 Bank: 500.00 Total Points: 1,070.00 Donate	for some reason I don't doubt this.

05-24-2006, 07:41 PM	#14
Darth_Flava Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: North Carolina Posts: 95 Thanks: 0 Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts Points: 3,779.92 Bank: 500.00 Total Points: 4,279.92 Donate	Even I though I understand that this was just another attempt to get a reaction out us. I'm still going to post. To think that the government would really kill 3000 people just so they could have a reason to invade an oil rich nation is one of the lamest excuses of a thread. Sure oil is always going to be a reason to try to get into a country, but anyone who believes this bull**** really needs to get a life.

05-25-2006, 07:37 AM	#15
Legion Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Greater Mancester, UK Gender: Posts: 1,860 Thanks: 10 Thanked 16 Times in 11 Posts Points: 7,661.29 Bank: 6,647.77 Total Points: 14,309.06 Donate	9/11 was a hoax? Rather than, you know, a set-up, which I think is what you're getting at?

08-28-2006, 10:48 PM	#16
Princess Zelda of Hyrule Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Hyrule Castle Gender: Posts: 6,128 Thanks: 35 Thanked 14 Times in 10 Posts Points: 6,041.36 Bank: 500.00 Total Points: 6,541.36 Donate	I might have considered that conspiracy theory had I not known how viciously people hate Bush. They hate him enough to step on the dead and the bereaved as their soapbox.

08-28-2006, 11:38 PM	#17
Prince Toad PC Mod Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Rookery Gender: Posts: 11,394 Thanks: 42 Thanked 56 Times in 47 Posts Points: 42,226.88 Bank: 15,935.33 Total Points: 58,162.21 Donate	That shouldn't affect your reaction. Don't consider the theory because it's fallacious, not because people hate Bush.

08-29-2006, 04:09 AM	#18
Koga Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: The Netherlands Gender: Posts: 17,094 Thanks: 105 Thanked 177 Times in 119 Posts Points: 103,439.41 Bank: 17,752.41 Total Points: 121,191.82 Donate	It's really much more likely that the US government knew something like this was going to happen and didn't act on it, than that they did so themselves. Not that I believe either.

08-29-2006, 11:35 AM	#19
Princess Zelda of Hyrule Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Hyrule Castle Gender: Posts: 6,128 Thanks: 35 Thanked 14 Times in 10 Posts Points: 6,041.36 Bank: 500.00 Total Points: 6,541.36 Donate	It affects my reaction because I highly, highly, highly suspect someone's got a not-so-productive agenda. Our country gets attacked and all our people can do is recognize another opportunity for left versus right.

08-29-2006, 08:15 PM	#20
Prince Toad PC Mod Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Rookery Gender: Posts: 11,394 Thanks: 42 Thanked 56 Times in 47 Posts Points: 42,226.88 Bank: 15,935.33 Total Points: 58,162.21 Donate	^^Well, there was that little memo that said "Bin Laden Determined To Attack Inside United States" or whatever. So yeah, they might've had a little hint. I guess they didn't have full details or anything, no.