Why I support McCain - Page 2 - VGF

**Crazyswordsman** · 05-10-2008, 08:55 PM

Is that so, well, there should be people out there making sure people have free IDs. -CSM

Lurch1982 · 05-11-2008, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by betasoldier

Funniest thing I've ever heard. That talk was around a long time before Bush. I live in Indiana dude, come on. Also, you can apply for the plain state ID, for free, and get it, for free, for voting. It was all put out in plenty of time for everyone eligible and wanting to vote to get one. Or you could use a drivers license or other form of state/federal ID. **** man come on, that ****ing hilarious.

I live in the poor area of my town, one of the few white families, love all my black neighbors (we actually help each other out with stuff, I love neighbors like that). Basically, I don't know a single person that wants to vote and doesn't have an ID. Maybe there are some, but I haven't met them yet. Seriously, thats weak man.

Hell, I've helped my teacher help the elderly get their state ID's so they can vote. Not getting to vote because of no ID

The ones that didn't vote didn't want to.

Seriously, I'm laughing so hard I'm crying.

Oh, and Lurch, the whole problems with the Iraqi military that you mentioned, are in the minority and few and far between.

My advice to LinkManDX, don't bother. Just give it up. I agree with you on most of what your saying, but as I've come to learn this is the wrong forum for it man. You won't win, eventually Lurch will just resort to posts of just 100% insulting you without any other details. Just not worth the trouble because no one else seems to care about that fact, or if anything just egg him on to do it more. Other then those things, I'm not bothering to get involved in this.

I'm actually with you on the ID requirement. As long as its cheap/free to get one and accessible and notice is provided, I don't really care. If a state requires ID to vote and ups the ID fees to the same as a passport (which is, what, anywhere from 80-150 depending on the processing time?), I'd have a problem.

Sorry, I thought providing links to multiple news sources that are saying the opposite of what he's claiming McCain is saying is actually constructive and probably the furthest thing from insulting. Unless debunking a false notion is insulting.

And the problems in Iraq are the same in the forgotten war (Afghan.): an ineffective government that loses power once you leave the capital and a cluster of local militias that may or may not cooperate at any given time. For some reason, I don't think any critique on the Iraqi military is unfounded.

Recent examples in the news that should trigger some concern: "unmitigated disaster. 2008 dropped as target year for self-sufficiency; deadlines from Jan 2007 missed. Pentagon reports on progress unreliable. Here.

betasoldier · 05-11-2008, 07:58 PM

Lurch, I said eventually. Your doing fine right now. I'm talking about what this debate will degenerate into. See almost all of your past topics in this forum.

Sen. Brak Obama (FACE) · 05-11-2008, 08:06 PM

You mean what they turn into usually when the other person stops providing relevant information?

I lurk here more than people think

betasoldier · 05-11-2008, 11:43 PM

No, I mean quite the opposite really. I most assuredly agree with you in some case, but definitely I find the opposite in most cases lol. Especially considering for Lurch anything anyone else posts is irrelevant information. Or so says his ego. I could expand upon that but whatever, I don't really care, just making sure Linkman knows.

LinkManDX · 05-12-2008, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lurch1982

If Iraq were to fall into anarchy? What exactly do you call it when the central government has no authority once you get out of the protected zones, the military doesn't show up because they overslept, Iraqi military divisions acting like "death squads" against other ethnic or religious groups, kidnap+executions, open fighting against coalition forces, IEDs/roadside bombs, mortar attacks, etc.

It's already in anarchy or something close to it. After 8 years of not giving a **** of what foreign powers think, why exactly should we start now?

We're currently there to educate the Iraqi military not to do those sorts of things. It's taking a little longer than expected, but we can't just cut and run with Iraq in the state that it's currently in.

Quote:

Here's the difference: Obama's the equivalent of sitting in church and having your preacher say some stuff you don't agree with. Hillary joined some Washington group that really hasn't fallen out of step with US foreign policy in terms of supporting facists. Neither Hillary nor Obama sought endorsements from these groups. McCain sought out the endorsements of hatemongering kooks. That is the difference. If Obama is elected and the Wright scandal never happened, Wright wouldn't have any say or position in his administration. If McCain is elected, all of the kooks he got the endorsements of (in order to force Huckabee out of the race) are going to stand there with their hands out expecting some sort of quid pro quo exchange. IOW: one of their own in powerful positions.

The timeline you provided in that link links one article saying that he sought out that particular endorsement. In the same interview, he proceeded to deny or claim everything is out of contest. Why do we suddenly believe one thing and not the other?

Quote:

Concerning exceptions for abortion flip-flop.

The article doesn't give a single piece of evidence that he abandoned his position on the exceptions to abortion, a completely moderate and even non-Bush platform (The article even seems to say that he slammed Bush in 2000 for the very same reason).

Serial Miller · 05-12-2008, 11:05 PM

Supporting people like Hillary Clinton, John McCain, or even Barack Obama is ridiculous. They are agents of a broken system.

**Crazyswordsman** · 05-13-2008, 12:02 AM

^There's no such thing as a system that's not broken. -CSM

**Prince Toad** · 05-13-2008, 12:07 AM

^Well that clearly isn't true. And I don't even think what AI said is either. A system with problems isn't necessarily broken. (I could come up with countless gaming examples, but I'm sure you can use your imagination.)

Lurch1982 · 05-13-2008, 01:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by betasoldier

No, I mean quite the opposite really. I most assuredly agree with you in some case, but definitely I find the opposite in most cases lol. Especially considering for Lurch anything anyone else posts is irrelevant information. Or so says his ego. I could expand upon that but whatever, I don't really care, just making sure Linkman knows.

I like how I'm apparently the "troll" or whatever when you're the one coming into threads to derail them. If someone is factually wrong (ie: not in line with what is reported), I'm calling them out on it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LinkmanDX

We're currently there to educate the Iraqi military not to do those sorts of things. It's taking a little longer than expected, but we can't just cut and run with Iraq in the state that it's currently in.

I've never served in the military in my life and I know that you're not supposed to oversleep when you're supposed to be leading an operation. I also know that it probably isn't a good idea to segment the Army so that they're identical to the militias they recruited from.

Quote:

The timeline you provided in that link links one article saying that he sought out that particular endorsement. In the same interview, he proceeded to deny or claim everything is out of contest. Why do we suddenly believe one thing and not the other?

McCain is saying he didn't seek out the kook's endorsement. Kook is claiming McCain went to him. Both are saying the anti-Catholic comments are out of context. Here's a recent example: McCain personally wooed Hagee for more than a year.

Quote:

The article doesn't give a single piece of evidence that he abandoned his position on the exceptions to abortion, a completely moderate and even non-Bush platform (The article even seems to say that he slammed Bush in 2000 for the very same reason).

Sounds like he left the exceptions behind to me.

Demonicus Prime · 05-13-2008, 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by betasoldier

for Lurch anything anyone else posts is irrelevant information. Or so says his ego. I could expand upon that but whatever

So it's a courtesy to let someone be wrong in a debate where facts are the ammo?

I believe that any progress McCain makes will be negative, Hillary is bat **** crazy, and Obama has alot to prove. The fact is is that as long as Obama sticks to his word and his guns, he'll do fine. If the other two do, oh ****.

Serial Miller · 05-13-2008, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prince Toad

^Well that clearly isn't true. And I don't even think what AI said is either. A system with problems isn't necessarily broken. (I could come up with countless gaming examples, but I'm sure you can use your imagination.)

The government is driven by the economy. Capitalism at the US's levels of excess cannot be sustained without a fallboy - currently developed southeast Asia is that fallboy. What do you think will happen when Asia finally breaks out of the industrial age?

**Prince Toad** · 05-13-2008, 08:50 PM

I don't know, we'll shift the labor to Africa? It's the only place left poor enough. Eventually we should have the technology to handle factory labor by itself, if we last that long. Or, maybe, we'll cut back on our lifestyle enough to survive.

betasoldier · 05-13-2008, 11:15 PM

Maybe the fact that I put anyone instead of anything is confusing you all? Typo. Your missing the entire point of what I said. Whatever, not worth it. Tried to straighten it out before, but nobody listened then, nobody will listen now either.

Lurch1982 · 05-14-2008, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prince Toad

I don't know, we'll shift the labor to Africa? It's the only place left poor enough. Eventually we should have the technology to handle factory labor by itself, if we last that long. Or, maybe, we'll cut back on our lifestyle enough to survive.

Latin America and South America? A little more stable than Africa.

Serial Miller · 05-14-2008, 09:52 AM

^ That's most likely the first thing to happen. A lot of manufacturing has already switched to Mexico, mostly just because Asia can't sustain the output that western society has required. The point is that the system is driven by a short-sighted economy, and nobody in office or contending for office is actually acknowledging that the US economy will suffer as other countries begin to flourish. It's always the other guy's fault. Electing someone new isn't going to erase the history of out-sourcing industries, and it's that out-sourcing that is causing a decline in the US economy. When manufacturing starts becoming more expensive in other countries, prices are going to rise and the US dollar is going to be worth less and less. This sort of thing is out of any of their hands, for the most part, because none of them will actually turn their heads to the future. It's not the government that's hurting the country's economy, even if it's run by an ******* like Bush - the right sort of maneuvering can only be so conduscive.

Brandon2390 · 05-18-2008, 10:11 PM

YouTube - McCain's YouTube Problem Just Became a Nightmare - Thats PART OF the reason I dont support McCain.

Serial Miller · 05-19-2008, 11:20 PM

Thanks for the link, Brandon. Informative.

Brandon2390 · 05-21-2008, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Internet Tough Guy

Thanks for the link, Brandon. Informative.

Sarcasm or not?

Serial Miller · 05-23-2008, 09:29 AM

My sarcasm is obvious and derisively over-done, so not.

05-11-2008, 08:06 PM	#24
Sen. Brak Obama (FACE) Polk/McLaughlin '08: The Greatness You Already Knew Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Birmingham, AL Gender: Posts: 12,901 Thanks: 909 Thanked 646 Times in 378 Posts Points: 45,670.71 Bank: 436,098.14 Total Points: 481,768.85 Donate	You mean what they turn into usually when the other person stops providing relevant information? I lurk here more than people think __________________

05-10-2008, 08:55 PM	#21
Crazyswordsman RPG Mod Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Booyaville (yeah!) Gender: Posts: 7,918 Thanks: 530 Thanked 358 Times in 246 Posts Points: 119,750.17 Bank: 22,337.38 Total Points: 142,087.55 Donate	Is that so, well, there should be people out there making sure people have free IDs. -CSM

05-11-2008, 07:58 PM	#23
betasoldier Junior Member Join Date: May 2007 Gender: Posts: 106 Thanks: 10 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts Points: 2,809.66 Bank: 0.00 Total Points: 2,809.66 Donate	Lurch, I said eventually. Your doing fine right now. I'm talking about what this debate will degenerate into. See almost all of your past topics in this forum.

05-11-2008, 11:43 PM	#25
betasoldier Junior Member Join Date: May 2007 Gender: Posts: 106 Thanks: 10 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts Points: 2,809.66 Bank: 0.00 Total Points: 2,809.66 Donate	No, I mean quite the opposite really. I most assuredly agree with you in some case, but definitely I find the opposite in most cases lol. Especially considering for Lurch anything anyone else posts is irrelevant information. Or so says his ego. I could expand upon that but whatever, I don't really care, just making sure Linkman knows.

05-12-2008, 11:05 PM	#27
Serial Miller Retro Nintendo Supermod Art & Literature Mod Metroid Mod Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I rub my tilde all over your asterisk Gender: Posts: 15,679 Thanks: 416 Thanked 1,046 Times in 585 Posts Points: 14,115.59 Bank: 1,556,398.07 Total Points: 1,570,513.65 Donate	Supporting people like Hillary Clinton, John McCain, or even Barack Obama is ridiculous. They are agents of a broken system.

05-13-2008, 12:02 AM	#28
Crazyswordsman RPG Mod Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Booyaville (yeah!) Gender: Posts: 7,918 Thanks: 530 Thanked 358 Times in 246 Posts Points: 119,750.17 Bank: 22,337.38 Total Points: 142,087.55 Donate	^There's no such thing as a system that's not broken. -CSM

05-13-2008, 12:07 AM	#29
Prince Toad PC Mod Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Rookery Gender: Posts: 11,394 Thanks: 42 Thanked 56 Times in 47 Posts Points: 42,223.88 Bank: 15,935.33 Total Points: 58,159.21 Donate	^Well that clearly isn't true. And I don't even think what AI said is either. A system with problems isn't necessarily broken. (I could come up with countless gaming examples, but I'm sure you can use your imagination.)

05-13-2008, 08:50 PM	#33
Prince Toad PC Mod Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Rookery Gender: Posts: 11,394 Thanks: 42 Thanked 56 Times in 47 Posts Points: 42,223.88 Bank: 15,935.33 Total Points: 58,159.21 Donate	I don't know, we'll shift the labor to Africa? It's the only place left poor enough. Eventually we should have the technology to handle factory labor by itself, if we last that long. Or, maybe, we'll cut back on our lifestyle enough to survive.

05-13-2008, 11:15 PM	#34
betasoldier Junior Member Join Date: May 2007 Gender: Posts: 106 Thanks: 10 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts Points: 2,809.66 Bank: 0.00 Total Points: 2,809.66 Donate	Maybe the fact that I put anyone instead of anything is confusing you all? Typo. Your missing the entire point of what I said. Whatever, not worth it. Tried to straighten it out before, but nobody listened then, nobody will listen now either.

05-14-2008, 09:52 AM	#36
Serial Miller Retro Nintendo Supermod Art & Literature Mod Metroid Mod Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I rub my tilde all over your asterisk Gender: Posts: 15,679 Thanks: 416 Thanked 1,046 Times in 585 Posts Points: 14,115.59 Bank: 1,556,398.07 Total Points: 1,570,513.65 Donate	^ That's most likely the first thing to happen. A lot of manufacturing has already switched to Mexico, mostly just because Asia can't sustain the output that western society has required. The point is that the system is driven by a short-sighted economy, and nobody in office or contending for office is actually acknowledging that the US economy will suffer as other countries begin to flourish. It's always the other guy's fault. Electing someone new isn't going to erase the history of out-sourcing industries, and it's that out-sourcing that is causing a decline in the US economy. When manufacturing starts becoming more expensive in other countries, prices are going to rise and the US dollar is going to be worth less and less. This sort of thing is out of any of their hands, for the most part, because none of them will actually turn their heads to the future. It's not the government that's hurting the country's economy, even if it's run by an ******* like Bush - the right sort of maneuvering can only be so conduscive.

05-18-2008, 10:11 PM	#37
Brandon2390 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Connecticut Posts: 10,315 Thanks: 5 Thanked 16 Times in 13 Posts Points: 35,458.12 Bank: 742.97 Total Points: 36,201.09 Donate	YouTube - McCain's YouTube Problem Just Became a Nightmare - Thats PART OF the reason I dont support McCain.

05-19-2008, 11:20 PM	#38
Serial Miller Retro Nintendo Supermod Art & Literature Mod Metroid Mod Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I rub my tilde all over your asterisk Gender: Posts: 15,679 Thanks: 416 Thanked 1,046 Times in 585 Posts Points: 14,115.59 Bank: 1,556,398.07 Total Points: 1,570,513.65 Donate	Thanks for the link, Brandon. Informative.

05-23-2008, 09:29 AM	#40
Serial Miller Retro Nintendo Supermod Art & Literature Mod Metroid Mod Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I rub my tilde all over your asterisk Gender: Posts: 15,679 Thanks: 416 Thanked 1,046 Times in 585 Posts Points: 14,115.59 Bank: 1,556,398.07 Total Points: 1,570,513.65 Donate	My sarcasm is obvious and derisively over-done, so not.