Who was the REAL villian of Final Fantasy X?

[Dark Seraphim]

I don't think that any of us could say that Final Fantasy X wasn't at least an entertaining game, whether eveyone thinks its good or bad is their own opinion, of course. However, the weakest aspect of the game is the seemingly lack of main villain, oh there's plenty of badguys, but who really is the 'Main Villain" of Final Fantasy X? There were 4 character in the game that seem closest to being associated with being the feature villain of the game, and listed my thoughts on what does and does not make them villain material.

Sin


What makes him the villain:

For the majority of the game, Sin stands as the force of fear and power in the game, he is coveted by two of the other applicants on this like (Seymour and Yevon) and feared and hated by the masses of Spira. Sin has stood to lay waste and destruction for 1000 years, only offering respite when a summoner offers to kill one of their own guardians and then sacrifice themselves to offer a 'Calm' of normally 10 years before the cycle of fear and death begins again.

What makes him NOT the villain:

Despite the grandeur, I consider Sin to be the least likely to be considered the 'Main Villain' of Final Fantasy X. Even if he is the force of fear and death in Spira, in the end Sin itself is basically a mindless power, and is more a tool to be controlled by the other villains in the game. This puts him up there in the same category as the Void from FFV or Meteor from FFVII, sure, Sin has the power to be the villain, but lacks the mind or the motive, its just a weapon.

Seymour Guado


What makes him the villain: Seymour may very well be the most evil person in Spira itself, coming from a tragic past filled with prejudice and abandonment, he rose up to slay his own father for power, and shows no remorse in using people like pawns for his own ends. Even death itself was unable to stop him, as he lives on as an abomination, harboring the desire to bring salvation to all of Spira by killing everyone, slaying the world to make a Spira of the dead to rule over like a god.


What makes him NOT the villain: OK, to be honest Seymour has all the motive and making of the game's main villain, he is murderously insane, wants to ascend to godhood, however I really think he believes he's doing the right thing, making him even more twisted and dangerous. Sadly . . . Seymour suffers from the lack of power to meet his goal, he has all the makings of a great villain, a painful past to cloud his judgement, the motive to hurt millions, and even the mindset that what he is doing is right, but he doesn't have the force to stand up to claim that title, although he does try (and fail) to gain that power, he is more in the category of Xande from FFII or Kuja from FFIX, he's a major threat, but there's just something with more authority that him to make him the 'Main Villain.'

Jecht


What makes him the villain:

Jecht is a brash man who seems to act the main character's foil int he game, causing Tidus an almost obsessive compulsion to get back at his father for his neglectful attitude towards him. Not only that, but Jetch bolsters two horrible forms of power, not only being at the center of Sin itself, but harboring his own powerful body as the Final Summoning of the last calm, killing the very summoner he was meant to protect. As an additional nod towards the title of 'Main Villain' Jecht was recently chosen to represent Chaos for the game Final Fantasy Dissidia, above the other choices on the list here.

What makes him NOT the villain:

Simply enough, Jecht has no villainous motive, anything that he's done to be considered 'evil' was either not his fault, or was resolved by the end of the game. He resolved things with his son, Tidus, and it wasn't his fault he was harbored by Sin, as his body was possessed by Yu Yevon. Even in Dissidia it was stated that although he has a 'body of darkness' he had a 'heart of light'. Really, Jecht falls under the same cirsumstanes as Golbez from FFIV or Edea from FFVIII, he's not evil, he's just being used as a tool, not unlike Sin itself.

Yu Yevon


What makes him the villain:

Yu Yevon is the cause of all the death and dispair in Spira, he keeps the infinite loop going, sacrificing the entire city of Zanarkand and tranforming them into the horrible beast of Sin to lay waste for any and all who oppose him. He excels in false hope, he turns a summoner's sacrifice into a murder and turns the body of the weapon used against him into his own prisoner, all while an entire civilzation reveres him as a God and prays to him for a mercy that never comes.

What makes him NOT the villain:

That's all well and good, but Yu Yevon was probabaly the most anti-climatic part of the game itself. He doesn't even have a body, all he appears as is a glowing symbol on a floating rock, in a fight that may as well have been a CGI cut-scene as its practically scripted thanks to the auto-life every character just so happens to have. Yu Yevon may have been the root of all evil, but honestly he is more reminiscent of Euno from FFV or Jenova from FFVIII, he's just the source of the current evil, but not the Main Villain anymore. Granted this sort of 'source' theory also could lead back to Cloud of Darkness or Zeromus, but Yu Yevon definately loses his foothold as the 'Main Villain' of Final Fantasy X with his lack of intimidating appearence and the (practically) scripted final battle.

In conclusion, really, none of the villains of FFX seem to have all it takes to obvious rise above the others as the Main Villain. Sin as the power, but lacks any sort of sentience over its destructive actions. Seymour has all the motive and mindset of an evil villain, but ends up being more bark than bite. Jecht offers the feel of a 'Epic Final Boss Fight' with his Final Summon, but beyond that he really offers nothing in the way of a threat of evil, he willingly offered to killed to release Yu Yevon. And as for Yu Yevon, he gets built up as this end-all evil, the source of it all, but when the party finally meets him, he's this mindless, disembodied floating symbol in a pathetic scripted battle scene, losing any credibility as the final threat of the game. Honestly what I would have done differenty? I would have held off on the Seymour battle until AFTER Jecht's Final Aeon fight, then would have had Yu Yevon enter the spirit body of Seymour Guado, basically combining Seymour's evil motives and intentions with the legacy and power of Yu Yevon, making a real epic finaly battle. They could have even left in the part where you need to sacrifice all the Aeons first to make the final fight that much more difficult, but that simple change in roster would have led to a real final battle, as opposed to the false final fight in Jecht and the dissapointing scripted battle in Yu Yevon, with Seymour being killed off and sent before either of them even started.

But as I said, this is just my own opinion on the subject!

[ZeldaGirl]

I liked the combination of Seymour and Yu Yevon, and I do think that would have worked, but...I don't think FFX necessarily suffers from having one ultimate bad guy (although Yu Yevon was a cop-out, I mean seriously, you can't even die). The thing is, is the system that's the most evil thing in the game - the entire religion and culture is corrupt. People were overcome by their greed and lust for power in the beginning, which is why Yu Yevon summoned Sin to destroy everything...but then he selfishly got caught up in being the most powerful being, and so didn't want to relinquish his grasp on it. It's the same with Yevon (the religion); full of corruption from the leaders (Mika, Kinoc, of course, Seymour). I like to think that the developers intended for the game to represent a battle between humanity, between the people and the corrupted establishment (which arguably encompasses all of Yevon, Yu and Seymour included).

So, I guess the way I see it is, Sin is a weapon, Jecht is a tool (lawl), and the real baddies are Yevon itself (in every sense of the word; the religion, the people within the religion, and the parasite itself).

But, I don't think there necessarily needs to be only ONE villain.

EDIT: You mentioned Jenova. I would say that FF7 has this same problem...actually, now that I think about it, I think most FF games do. There isn't one true villain (Kefka probably excepted...); I mean, off the top of my head, Sephiroth is considered the baddie in 7, but he's arguably either under the control of Jenova (or the other way around, I vary on that opinion sometimes), or he's just plain ****ed up...because of Hojo. Honestly, I think you could make a strong case for Hojo being responsible for every ****ing thing that happens in this game, making him the true villain. Same with FF9 - Kuja was ****ed up, but it was because of a very real reaction he had to Garland's behavior; so, who's the one TRUE villain (also, Necron ftw wtf?)? Could you really say? I don't know. But the real question is: Do you need to?

[Dark Seraphim]

I see your point, and I had not thought of that angle before, that the society of Yevon itself, the religion of Yevon, that every aspect of the person, faith, and belief in general would be considered the true evil of the game itself.

Truthfully I was speaking more of a central being though who steps forward as the final threat to the game to uphold the evil presented to the players. Although Jenova and Hojo certainly were a major influence, Jenova was more a source of evil, and Hojo was an instigater, possibly in the same league as Seymour himself, he had more of the true evil intention but did not have the bite to back up his bark, in the end Sephiroth however rose up and actually posed a viable threat, wanting to use Meteor to ruin the world and steal its lifestream and ascend into the ranks of godhood, although you're right, it certainly gets shakey in quite a few of the Final Fantasy games.

in Final Fantasy III Xande is considered the threat throughout the game, but then Cloud of Darkness comes out of no where and offers the true final threat of evil, same with Golbez/Zeromus from FFIV, and Kuja/Necron from FFIX. Some games have obvious villains, Choas, Emperor of Hell, Ultimecia is pretty much the villain for most of the game, although Edea and Seifer are used as tools much like Jecht was. It seems there are quite a few villain/evil types in Final Fantasy, in FFX we get the Power (Sin), the Tool (Jecht), the False Villain (Seymour), and the Root (Yu Yevon) but it seems none of them in the end rise up to be that real "Final Threat Epic Battle" that we usually get at the end of Final Fantasy games is all.

[I REALLY HATE POKEMON!]

Upon careful consideration, they all played their part and there doesn't necessarily need to be "one final main villain" orchestrating things. In fact, I am kind of glad they blurred things.

[Dark Seraphim]

I suppose having it blurred isn't so bad, but I do still stand behind my idea that having Seymour appear after the Final Summon Jecht fight and merging with Yu Yevon would have been a very nice way to tie the game together, in the end they painted Seymour up as they great noble evil, and in the end he's kinda killed off before the real bedlum gets underway.

Plus I think a Seymour Yevon final boss may have been better then the weird Seymour Omnus we got . . . but that's just me.

[ZeldaGirl]

^I think that would have been an interesting concept as well. Ah well...

[Dark Seraphim]

They even set up during the game that Seymour that absorb spiritual/ghost bodies, he did so twice during th game, first in Beville, and then again when he slaughtered all the Ronsos. So him absorbing Yu Yevon to join with him in a deranged bid for godhood to clense the world of all life would have been an good twist.

Really, in the end you killed Seymour so Spira is no longer being ruled by the dead, so the current plot of SPira being run by corruption and death is sorta resolved there, and then personal plot between Tidus and Jecht is cleared up soon after that, the whole Yu Yevon thing just seems like a "oh yeah, and there's this thing you need to do too, just to tie up the loose ends."

Heh, again that's just my opinion.

[Sim Kid]

Not everyone seems to appreciate the simple blurring of it all, unfortunately. You just know that if they established that one of them was the REAL villain that there would be as much people saying "But it should have been SEYMOUR!" or "They should have BLURRED THE LINES MORE!"

[Crazyswordsman]

I actually think it was Yunalesca. I think when Yu Yevon created Sin, he expected to control it (and bring disaster to places that he could control, for example, those building up military arsenals). But he eventually lost control and Sin turned into a machine of sorts (notice how a lot of humanitarian machina are banned, although Yu Yevon just wanted to get rid of weapons). Yunalesca probably saw this but didn't do anything. -CSM

[ZeldaGirl]

^That's a damn good point. She was just evil.

[Marilink dislikes smoke]

The Grid Sphere.

[Sim Kid]

Originally Posted by Marilink dislikes smoke

The Grid Sphere.

I find this amusing. XD

And honestly I'm laughing because I can see why you think that - not "LOL SPHERE GRID TOO COMPLEX 4 U? SUCK TWILIGHT YOU NOOBLING!"-type amusing.

[ZeldaGirl]

Am I the only person that actually liked the sphere grid?

[The Doctor]

^ No, I liked it too.

[Black Belt Tazy]

Giygas.

[Perrin Aybara]

The Sphere Grid was kinda neat. And was a hundred times better than the lame ass License Grid.

I thought the real villain of FFX was Squaresoft.

No wait, that was FF12.

-jay

[Crazyswordsman]

Originally Posted by ZeldaGirl

Am I the only person that actually liked the sphere grid?

Originally Posted by Crazyswordsman

It's definitely worth playing; it has one of my favorite battle systems. (All you Sphere Grid haters can bite me).

-CSM

[Dark Seraphim]

My biggest complaint though, is without a main villian all we got for a final boss is some floating, brainless rock that had all the challenge and intimidation of an imp. Honestly, the whole "having to kill your Aeons and then face the final boss" was a good gimmick, really good, it would have made the final boss probabaly one of the hardest in Final Fantasy history, harder than Ultimecia where you lose the ability to use Overdrives (they already didn't let you have Aeons out for more than 1 turn against bosses before they are 1-hit killed) and then have to face a challenging final boss.

It was sad because we got some good lead up to it too, first we fight Seymour Omnis, then we have to fight Braska's Final Aeon and then . . . gloating spider rock with glowing symbol while we all have Auto-Life . . . yay? I have no qualsm with what they were doing, trying to keep the real villian of the game more ambiguous, that's fine, I just think the game should have delivered us a real final challenge, instead of leaving it the way it did and having it frankly be almost insulting. We just played our way through the entire game! We beat Yunalesca, Jecht, and Seymour and then they pull the last punch, I just wanted something more epic and breathtaking, not a floating piece of rubble.

[Auron]

Originally Posted by Perrin Aybara

The Sphere Grid was kinda neat. And was a hundred times better than the lame ass License Grid.

I thought the real villain of FFX was Squaresoft.

No wait, that was FF12.

-jay

I just hated everything about FF12's gameplay. I can't say anything about that story because FF12 was the first FF I couldn't finish. I hated the gameplay that much.

^And I totally agree with that. FFX's end bosses would have been much better had they just cut the Yu Yevon bull**** and left it with Seymour and Jecht. Or made Yu Yevon a lot more badass looking and capable of actually killing you. Going through the whole game hearing about how Yevon completely screwed the world up, I was expecting someone that looked a lot... eviler than what he actually was.

[Dark Seraphim]

Exactly! I mean, ok, keeping the real enemy ambigous is fine, its a great catch, but Yu Yevon was supposed to be completely insane, having lost his mind, and I wanted a final battle that could showcase that, fighting something that caused terror in the hearts of all of Spira for some thousand years, I want something to be scared of!

Random idea, how about instead of fighting the Aeons one at a time, it starts summonging them and each time one is killed is doesn't dissapear, instead Yu Yevon forces another one from Yuna and combines them, making a twisted Chimera of all your previous Aeons, until it becomes a Hideou mosaic of all of them. In the end this would also allude to how far you went in the game, as in the end there could be a few different types of Yu Yevon Aeon Mosaics, The basic 5, + Yojimbo, +Anima, and +the Magus Sisters, and you'd be fighting this godlike image of all your previous allies intertwined like some hideous demon of hell! At least that's one idea. Intsead of fighting them all one at a time and then just fighting a floating rock.