(Small) Complaint about Super Mario Bros. Wii

Dark Seraphim · 11-16-2009, 02:12 AM

Now first of all, I am enjoying the game, this is a small complaint to which I consider laziness on the developer's part.

I personally don't like the fact that for 4-player co-op they decided to add in not 1 but 2 generic Toads. I mean I could forgive 1, but why a second random one? Its not even Toadette, just some nameless blue Toad, I think its a little silly as there were a lot of better choices in my opinion.

I think they should have considered Wario and Waluigi instead, they wouldn't have to make them anything weird or change their mechanics, they didn't change them for the Toads, and it would have probabaly been a nice little bonus to the game.

Wario has already been established as a sometimes anti-hero, thanks for Mario 64 DS, and has been known to have feelings for Peach, so his aid wouldn't have been too outlandish. And it would have been very good to finally have Waluigi in actual platforming, I'm sure a lot of the Mario franchise fans would have been excited to see that!

Oh well, I still enjoy the game and I'm playing it alone anyway, so I'm only playing as Mario, but that's just my two cents.

**Valigarmander** · 11-16-2009, 02:34 AM

A lot of people have had this gripe.

And apparently they didn't have Peach as a character because they'd have to develop dress physics specifically for her.

PK FIRE! · 11-16-2009, 02:40 AM

Huh well I guess that the hats(?) the toads were would be simpaler to do especily given how Peache's dress would react in air, in water, while running. Hypothetical question then, if Peach was playible who would the group be saving then?

- You stupid dog.

Dark Seraphim · 11-16-2009, 02:43 AM

They wouldn't have really had to do any additional physics for Wario and Waluigi.

Quote:

Originally Posted by PK FIRE!

Hypothetical question then, if Peach was playible who would the group be saving then?

The Toad Chancellor maybe? That would be a nice change of pace, Bowser could actually kidnap the Chancellor and blackmail Peach into giving into him or something.

PK FIRE! · 11-16-2009, 02:50 AM

There is also the possiblity that Nintendo would have just had Daisy get kiddnapped in Peaches' sted. though both of these are just a few of the possiblities if Peach had been programmed in as playible.

On a diffrent topic altogether I'd love to see Nintendo make a Final Fantasy Tactics style RPG with thier bigs stars al la Smash Brothers.

- You stupid dog.

Dark Seraphim · 11-16-2009, 02:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PK FIRE!

There is also the possiblity that Nintendo would have just had Daisy get kiddnapped in Peaches' sted. though both of these are just a few of the possiblities if Peach had been programmed in as playible.

On a diffrent topic altogether I'd love to see Nintendo make a Final Fantasy Tactics style RPG with thier bigs stars al la Smash Brothers.

- You stupid dog.

You mean like the Space Embassy or whatever it was called in Smash Bros. but in a turn-based or tactics style RPG format?

PK FIRE! · 11-16-2009, 03:02 AM

Yeah something like that, IRHP and I were kicking the idea around a while ago, Plumbers would have filled the Dragoon/Lancer class with Mario being a TG Cid like figure of song and story, Toads would have been the Squire class, Magikoopas as Black Mages, Yoshies acting as Chocobo Stand ins, Link Would have been the template for the Knight class ect. I don't think we got much further along then that before the idea died.

Anyway I hope this doesn't highjack the main topic. I don't even know why I brought it back up it just popped into mind while I wrote my last post.

- You stupid dog.

Robotazy · 11-16-2009, 03:45 AM

The Toads did seem like a strange choice, but If you think about it, no one else would really come to peach's aide.

Wario likes money so there's no specific eason for him to try and save Peach. Same goes fo Waluigi.

I guess if anyone would rush to Peach;s rescue, it would be Daisy, and...well Toad.

**Loot** · 11-16-2009, 08:29 AM

Wario really seems like he wouldn't fit in with the typical Mario style. He's a bit slow and can't jump high, but ~~this Kong's one hell of a guy~~ he can beat the crap out of anything that gets in his way. Also, Wario working with Mario? Not gonna happen.

***the Octopus*** · 11-16-2009, 08:43 AM

Yeah, I actually really appreciate the lack of "new" characters outside of Bowser Jr. I also don't think Wario would've fit whatsoever, especially considering how differently he handles in his own game series, and as far as that other guy goes I'm irritated just to be reminded he exists. The Toads are actually rather adorable, which will be more likely to attract an older audience than the two W's. Besides, Toad wasn't anything to complain about in SMB2, and I love that game.

Then again, you guys probably don't even think to consider Wario a newer character, despite the fact he's never once appeared in the Super Mario Bros. series. I don't dislike him in the least, but it wouldn't feel particularily true to the series, IMO.

PS. Toadette is stupid.

***Saria Dragon of the Rain Wilds*** · 11-16-2009, 08:45 AM

I like the Toads. Hell, I like them better than Mario and Luigi. Wario, and espeically Waluigi would've been terrible. I would've been so utterly disappointed if they had included either, I can't even begin to express. Peach was off being kidnapped, so she's out. I don't see any problems sticking with the "traditional" character types. Do you hate Toads, or something?

Toad-hater.

Yes, Toadette is stupid. What's the point of a female-specific Toad? It's like the Smurfs, and their stupid single-female-Smurf bullcrap. Grah.

Dark Seraphim · 11-16-2009, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saria Dragon of the Rain Wilds

Toad-hater.

Hey now!

I don't mind Toad, but:

1) They didn't have to fill BOTH 3rd and 4th player slots with Toad, 1 would have been fine and they could have been creative with the second one, maybe even one of the old partners from the Paper Mario games?

2) Both of the "Toads" aren't even Toad! Toad is red spotted with a blue vest, he's the real Toad. These are just generic yellow and blue versions pallet swaps.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Bureau

Then again, you guys probably don't even think to consider Wario a newer character, despite the fact he's never once appeared in the Super Mario Bros. series. I don't dislike him in the least, but it wouldn't feel particularily true to the series, IMO.

Mario 64 DS doesn't count?

***the Octopus*** · 11-16-2009, 09:42 AM

That's not a Super Mario Bros. title, man. It's a crappy re-release of a pre-existing, formerly-decent game at that. Specifically, I'm talking about games with Super Mario Bros. in the title. There were only 3 of them until the first NSMB came along, although I suppose you could argue to include Super Mario World. It notably lacked the world-level management system, though, and instead favored a single world, divided into territories.

Also, Luigi was just a generic Mario palette swap.

Whether or not you know it, the different Mario series are all well and alive today, although there have been some transitions over the years.

Super Mario World segued into the Yoshi series with Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island. Super Mario Land segued into the Wario series with Super Mario Land 2, and then Super Mario Land 3: Wario Land. Super Mario 64 has since then passed the 3D Super Mario torch onto Super Mario Sunshine and then Super Mario Galaxy.

Super Mario RPG was granted indirect sequels in the line of both the Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi titles.

Super Mario Kart is obviously alive and kicking with direct sequels in line.

Nintendo's NES Golf and Tennis titles both featured appearances by Mario, and segued into Mario-themed sports titles later on.

That ref look familiar?

How about those guys?

Basically, Wario is more or less Super Mario Land territory, more than anything, and that just got a recent installment:

Dark Seraphim · 11-16-2009, 10:10 AM

If you really wanna get technical, the only game where Toad was a playable character was in Mario 2, which everyone knows isn't a real Mario game, as much as people love it, it was based on an Arabian style game where they inserted Mario, Luigi, Peach, and Load into the character spots.

Besides that one instance, Toad has never been an actual playable character, and in fact can be seen as being just as much out of place as anyone else, mostly since this is the first platforming Mario game to have 4 character co-op.

I guess in the end they could have filled the 3rd and 4th spot with anyone, and as I said 1 Toad is fine, I just wish they wouldn't have just used 2 pallet swapped Toads.

I won't touch the Luigi is just a pallet swap comment, because I could argue both sides fairly, its both true and misleading by this point.

EDIT: I guess you have a point. Although there are many versions of Mario (Super, Land, Paper) they do seem to work, at least somewhat, independently of each other.

***the Octopus*** · 11-16-2009, 10:21 AM

Palette. Swap.

And Super Mario Bros. 2 is still a title in the Super Mario Bros series. Doki Doki Panic was indeed another game made by Nintendo, and reformatted to suit the American audience as another installment in the Super Mario Bros. series. There is no debating that it was actually released as a Super Mario Bros. title, and featured Toad as a playable character. The character sprites weren't the only modifications to the game, either, but I'll leave your education on the subject up to you. And I'll remind you that it alone is responsible for inspiring the differentiation of Luigi as being the tall, thinner brother from mere palette swap. He went back to in-game palette swap status in SMB 3 and SMW.

Metal Mario · 11-16-2009, 12:48 PM

^^^You forgot that

led to

which still thrives as

JaredThaJa888 · 11-16-2009, 02:12 PM

I would like a new Donkey Kong Country Game.

Dark Seraphim · 11-16-2009, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaredThaJa888

I would like a new Donkey Kong Country Game.

So would a lot of people, unfortunately since Microsoft bought out Rare and the Country title belong to them, but DK himself belongs to Nintendo, there's not going to be much chance of that right now.

JaredThaJa888 · 11-16-2009, 02:46 PM

What's even more annoying about it neither Toad is Toad, their both characters who's earlier appearances had just been as Peach's Groupies.

Dark Seraphim · 11-16-2009, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaredThaJa888

What's even more annoying about it neither Toad is Toad, their both characters who's earlier appearances had just been as Peach's Groupies.

See that's what I said!

Quote:

2) Both of the "Toads" aren't even Toad! Toad is red spotted with a blue vest, he's the real Toad. These are just generic yellow and blue versions pallet swaps.

11-16-2009, 02:12 AM	#1
Dark Seraphim Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Gender: Posts: 431 Thanks: 4 Thanked 20 Times in 15 Posts	(Small) Complaint about Super Mario Bros. Wii Now first of all, I am enjoying the game, this is a small complaint to which I consider laziness on the developer's part. I personally don't like the fact that for 4-player co-op they decided to add in not 1 but 2 generic Toads. I mean I could forgive 1, but why a second random one? Its not even Toadette, just some nameless blue Toad, I think its a little silly as there were a lot of better choices in my opinion. I think they should have considered Wario and Waluigi instead, they wouldn't have to make them anything weird or change their mechanics, they didn't change them for the Toads, and it would have probabaly been a nice little bonus to the game. Wario has already been established as a sometimes anti-hero, thanks for Mario 64 DS, and has been known to have feelings for Peach, so his aid wouldn't have been too outlandish. And it would have been very good to finally have Waluigi in actual platforming, I'm sure a lot of the Mario franchise fans would have been excited to see that! Oh well, I still enjoy the game and I'm playing it alone anyway, so I'm only playing as Mario, but that's just my two cents.

11-16-2009, 02:34 AM	#2
Valigarmander The Bee's Knees Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: The land of rain and trees (Oregon) Gender: Posts: 29,223 Thanks: 1,611 Thanked 5,553 Times in 2,499 Posts Blog Entries: 18	A lot of people have had this gripe. And apparently they didn't have Peach as a character because they'd have to develop dress physics specifically for her. __________________

11-16-2009, 09:42 AM	#13
*the Octopus* THE PRESIDENT OF FUN Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I rub my tilde all over your asterisk Gender: Posts: 27,481 Thanks: 1,974 Thanked 5,121 Times in 2,320 Posts	That's not a Super Mario Bros. title, man. It's a crappy re-release of a pre-existing, formerly-decent game at that. Specifically, I'm talking about games with Super Mario Bros. in the title. There were only 3 of them until the first NSMB came along, although I suppose you could argue to include Super Mario World. It notably lacked the world-level management system, though, and instead favored a single world, divided into territories. Also, Luigi was just a generic Mario palette swap. Whether or not you know it, the different Mario series are all well and alive today, although there have been some transitions over the years. Super Mario World segued into the Yoshi series with Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island. Super Mario Land segued into the Wario series with Super Mario Land 2, and then Super Mario Land 3: Wario Land. Super Mario 64 has since then passed the 3D Super Mario torch onto Super Mario Sunshine and then Super Mario Galaxy. Super Mario RPG was granted indirect sequels in the line of both the Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi titles. Super Mario Kart is obviously alive and kicking with direct sequels in line. Nintendo's NES Golf and Tennis titles both featured appearances by Mario, and segued into Mario-themed sports titles later on. That ref look familiar? How about those guys? Basically, Wario is more or less Super Mario Land territory, more than anything, and that just got a recent installment: Last edited by the Octopus; 11-16-2009 at 10:14 AM.

11-16-2009, 10:10 AM	#14
Dark Seraphim Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Gender: Posts: 431 Thanks: 4 Thanked 20 Times in 15 Posts	If you really wanna get technical, the only game where Toad was a playable character was in Mario 2, which everyone knows isn't a real Mario game, as much as people love it, it was based on an Arabian style game where they inserted Mario, Luigi, Peach, and Load into the character spots. Besides that one instance, Toad has never been an actual playable character, and in fact can be seen as being just as much out of place as anyone else, mostly since this is the first platforming Mario game to have 4 character co-op. I guess in the end they could have filled the 3rd and 4th spot with anyone, and as I said 1 Toad is fine, I just wish they wouldn't have just used 2 pallet swapped Toads. I won't touch the Luigi is just a pallet swap comment, because I could argue both sides fairly, its both true and misleading by this point. EDIT: I guess you have a point. Although there are many versions of Mario (Super, Land, Paper) they do seem to work, at least somewhat, independently of each other. Last edited by Dark Seraphim; 11-16-2009 at 10:20 AM.

11-16-2009, 10:21 AM	#15
*the Octopus* THE PRESIDENT OF FUN Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I rub my tilde all over your asterisk Gender: Posts: 27,481 Thanks: 1,974 Thanked 5,121 Times in 2,320 Posts	Palette. Swap. And Super Mario Bros. 2 is still a title in the Super Mario Bros series. Doki Doki Panic was indeed another game made by Nintendo, and reformatted to suit the American audience as another installment in the Super Mario Bros. series. There is no debating that it was actually released as a Super Mario Bros. title, and featured Toad as a playable character. The character sprites weren't the only modifications to the game, either, but I'll leave your education on the subject up to you. And I'll remind you that it alone is responsible for inspiring the differentiation of Luigi as being the tall, thinner brother from mere palette swap. He went back to in-game palette swap status in SMB 3 and SMW. Last edited by the Octopus; 11-16-2009 at 10:27 AM.

11-16-2009, 02:40 AM	#3
PK FIRE! Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: On the run. Gender: Posts: 9,544 Thanks: 175 Thanked 150 Times in 120 Posts	Huh well I guess that the hats(?) the toads were would be simpaler to do especily given how Peache's dress would react in air, in water, while running. Hypothetical question then, if Peach was playible who would the group be saving then? - You stupid dog.

11-16-2009, 02:50 AM	#5
PK FIRE! Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: On the run. Gender: Posts: 9,544 Thanks: 175 Thanked 150 Times in 120 Posts	There is also the possiblity that Nintendo would have just had Daisy get kiddnapped in Peaches' sted. though both of these are just a few of the possiblities if Peach had been programmed in as playible. On a diffrent topic altogether I'd love to see Nintendo make a Final Fantasy Tactics style RPG with thier bigs stars al la Smash Brothers. - You stupid dog.

11-16-2009, 03:02 AM	#7
PK FIRE! Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: On the run. Gender: Posts: 9,544 Thanks: 175 Thanked 150 Times in 120 Posts	Yeah something like that, IRHP and I were kicking the idea around a while ago, Plumbers would have filled the Dragoon/Lancer class with Mario being a TG Cid like figure of song and story, Toads would have been the Squire class, Magikoopas as Black Mages, Yoshies acting as Chocobo Stand ins, Link Would have been the template for the Knight class ect. I don't think we got much further along then that before the idea died. Anyway I hope this doesn't highjack the main topic. I don't even know why I brought it back up it just popped into mind while I wrote my last post. - You stupid dog.

11-16-2009, 03:45 AM	#8
Robotazy PRESS ANY KEY TO PANIC! Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: A Tiny Shed Gender: Posts: 16,284 Thanks: 521 Thanked 1,238 Times in 885 Posts Blog Entries: 43	The Toads did seem like a strange choice, but If you think about it, no one else would really come to peach's aide. Wario likes money so there's no specific eason for him to try and save Peach. Same goes fo Waluigi. I guess if anyone would rush to Peach;s rescue, it would be Daisy, and...well Toad.

11-16-2009, 08:29 AM	#9
Loot whelp I'm a bloody moron Join Date: May 2001 Location: LEGITIMATE BUSINESS Gender: Posts: 12,524 Thanks: 226 Thanked 1,168 Times in 612 Posts	Wario really seems like he wouldn't fit in with the typical Mario style. He's a bit slow and can't jump high, but ~~this Kong's one hell of a guy~~ he can beat the crap out of anything that gets in his way. Also, Wario working with Mario? Not gonna happen.

11-16-2009, 08:43 AM	#10
*the Octopus* THE PRESIDENT OF FUN Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I rub my tilde all over your asterisk Gender: Posts: 27,481 Thanks: 1,974 Thanked 5,121 Times in 2,320 Posts	Yeah, I actually really appreciate the lack of "new" characters outside of Bowser Jr. I also don't think Wario would've fit whatsoever, especially considering how differently he handles in his own game series, and as far as that other guy goes I'm irritated just to be reminded he exists. The Toads are actually rather adorable, which will be more likely to attract an older audience than the two W's. Besides, Toad wasn't anything to complain about in SMB2, and I love that game. Then again, you guys probably don't even think to consider Wario a newer character, despite the fact he's never once appeared in the Super Mario Bros. series. I don't dislike him in the least, but it wouldn't feel particularily true to the series, IMO. PS. Toadette is stupid.

11-16-2009, 08:45 AM	#11
*Saria Dragon of the Rain Wilds* Admin "mine.. not yours. NO. MINE." Epic Ladynerd Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Forteresse de Valois Gender: Posts: 28,199 Thanks: 1,510 Thanked 1,719 Times in 993 Posts	I like the Toads. Hell, I like them better than Mario and Luigi. Wario, and espeically Waluigi would've been terrible. I would've been so utterly disappointed if they had included either, I can't even begin to express. Peach was off being kidnapped, so she's out. I don't see any problems sticking with the "traditional" character types. Do you hate Toads, or something? Toad-hater. Yes, Toadette is stupid. What's the point of a female-specific Toad? It's like the Smurfs, and their stupid single-female-Smurf bullcrap. Grah.

11-16-2009, 12:48 PM	#16
Metal Mario Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 1999 Gender: Posts: 16,435 Thanks: 72 Thanked 190 Times in 127 Posts	^^^You forgot that led to which still thrives as

11-16-2009, 02:12 PM	#17
JaredThaJa888 Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Racine Wisconsin Gender: Posts: 676 Thanks: 0 Thanked 14 Times in 14 Posts	I would like a new Donkey Kong Country Game.

11-16-2009, 02:46 PM	#19
JaredThaJa888 Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Racine Wisconsin Gender: Posts: 676 Thanks: 0 Thanked 14 Times in 14 Posts	What's even more annoying about it neither Toad is Toad, their both characters who's earlier appearances had just been as Peach's Groupies.