Congrats to Wyborn and Boo

[ZeldaGirl]

Oh please. Stop. He disagreed with you on a point. Get over it. Many people here in the forums hold different viewpoints, and they are entitled to express them. Instead of being offended that hey choose to express them, express your own in a non-volatile manner.

Wy has been known to be very honest and abrupt when giving his opinion. This does not make him a bad person. This MOST CERTAINLY does not disqualify him for modship. You have not been here long, and you certainly are not qualified to deem him "unworthy" - you hardly even know him!

He was found competent by numerous people who voted him, including Super-Mods (such as yours truly), and the ADMINISTRATORS.

Please, don't presume such things, because you hardly know the member you are insulting.

[Snow]

Originally Posted by ZeldaGirl

Oh please. Stop. He disagreed with you on a point. Get over it. Many people here in the forums hold different viewpoints, and they are entitled to express them. Instead of being offended that hey choose to express them, express your own in a non-volatile manner.

Wy has been known to be very honest and abrupt when giving his opinion. This does not make him a bad person. This MOST CERTAINLY does not disqualify him for modship. You have not been here long, and you certainly are not qualified to deem him "unworthy" - you hardly even know him!

He was found competent by numerous people who voted him, including Super-Mods (such as yours truly), and the ADMINISTRATORS.

Please, don't presume such things, because you hardly know the member you are insulting.

With all due respect what you said is fallacious and distorting my concerns. People do indeed hold different viewpoints, and if you would actually read what was said on that page you will see that I honored that and said that we are in disagreement, to which Wyborn accused me of trying to paint him as a "meanie" (again, attacking my character with some malicious intent, which is projection on his part). From the little I do know Wyborn, I can say that his being a moderator wholly shakes my confidence in the integrity of this forum, and I think that is far more telling than somebody who has "gotten to know," or more accurately, justify him.

Also you are accusing me of intent by saying that because he disagreed with me that I do not want him as a moderator. Frankly I could care less whether or not he agrees with me, as I said in that thread, I prefer clarity to agreement and we should find where we differ and accept it. However you pin me with motive by saying, very condescendingly, that I want to undo him because he disagrees and that I should "get over it." Personally I think that is extremely audacious of you, as it ignores what I actually said and dismisses me as narrow minded. I resent that thank you very much, the actual truth is that I love the Legend of Zelda series, and I found a good active forum for it, and one of the new moderators was just declared right after he chewed me out for nothing spare maybe his ego.

Also there was nothing honest about his opinion that I saw, but you're right when you say it was abrupt, and you left out the fact that it was dropped in the most disrespectful manner. We do all have opinions, and they should be shared civilly, and a moderator is there to make sure that happens, and Wyborn consistently chewed me out dishonestly, causelessly, in one thread without remorse. To be honest with you, I don't think that kind of attitude makes for modship. Now in my last post I said I could be wrong, and you make it as though I am disqualifying him entirely; but did I not say that these are my concerns? I did not say they were demands or absolutes. Such drama. Strange that you would project that I am calling him "unworthy," perhaps you deep down believe that, but this is really shaking my confidence, especially if this level of seething defensiveness is coming from a "super mod."

I am resident to a number of online forums without hindrance, very professional forums mostly comprised of adults with extremely advanced hobbies and interests, and the head administrators are typically running these forums as businesses, often charging fees or having fund raisers, raffles and the like. The Legend of Zelda and video gaming may be less elaborate than mechanics, military, weaponry, photography, linguistics, history, theology, philosophy, psychology and whatnot; or maybe just as elaborate, I could be wrong. However, I still think the same rules of professionalism applies, the same rules of discussion, the same laws of logic and the like. Also, common courtesy is a must. To be honest my concerns revolve around the immaturity of my welcome, and the scoffer being made a moderator, and a "super moderator" coming in to drive home the disrespect. Why do I stick around? Well I did like some of the threads and people, and when I said I would like to leave your other new resident moderator responded very warmly and I thank him for that. I may leave, but before I go I would like to point out the extremely poor customer service of this forum thus far.

If you wish to address what I have said, I have one personal rule for you to be taken seriously: First you tell the truth, then you give your opinion.

If you would like to throw courtesy onto that, that would be appreciated too.

[Wyborn]

Thank you, ZeldaGirl, but I think he's not getting the point.

Snow, read this carefully.

First of all, I'm getting the impression that either English isn't your first language or you're not entirely familiar with several of the words you throw around ("audacious", "condescending", even "hindrance") because you just discovered them or you never bothered to learn how to use them properly in the first place, but it doesn't matter; if you value clarity of language so much, be more clear and concise when you speak. It will benefit you immensely when speaking to anyone here in the future, because the nuances of the language are extremely important to quite a few of us, especially me.

Secondly, I don't particularly care what other forums you go to on the internet, if any, and I most certainly don't care if they are "mostly comprised of adults with extremely advanced hobbies and interests", as little sense as it makes to put a qualitative modifier like "advanced" on something like a hobby or interest. In fact, I doubt that any of us do. You are still expected to remain on-topic within a given discussion, which you have failed to do twice now, falling into unabashed whining in the Majora's Mask topic and doing something very similar here, this time at a supermod. That is an immense no-no, especially given the tone of superiority you try to assume when talking to someone who actually has a measure of authority. More than that, you have no authority whatsoever to set down ground rules for how a moderator will talk to you. If mods at VGF had more power, you would be lucky if ZG didn't slap you with an infraction for taking that tone with her and bashing your head against the administrative wall. That, friend, is going to stop right here.

I'm not going to argue with you in this topic, or the Majora's Mask topic, about who is right or wrong in the argument that flared up there when I came on too strong with my opinion. The only discussion that will continue in that topic will be about Majora's Mask, as I have tried to steer the conversation back to three times now, and this is pretty much a fluff topic that's going to die off fairly quickly by its very nature. There will be no more arguing about this matter in public.

You have three courses of action you may take from this point on, because anything else is going to result in more trouble that could have been avoided.

1. You can drop this childish vendetta and become a contributing member of these forums. Everyone ends up happy. Hurray!

2. You can bring your complaint to me in a Private Message, where it will be discussed without cluttering the boards.

3. You can send complaints about me in Private Message to one or all of our three administrators, Saria Dragon, Heroine of the Dragon, or the big boss of the boards who's owned this place since it got started, Shane. They might take a while to get back to you, as they are immensely busy with their own personal lives and so forth, but you will get results in one form or another.

And that's it. There will be no more continuation of this little series of attacks in this topic or any other. Posts to that affect will be deleted and filed away for review by the administrators, especially since you've been given this warning.

We're not mean people, Snow. Hell, I'm not mean. You just took a disagreement way too personally and blew it way out of proportion. Can't we let misunderstandings lie, and try to get along and have a good time here?

[Demonicus Prime]

Jesus tapdancing Christ. Two days as Mod, and Wy's already pulling a
Fils-Aime.

[Booyakasha]

^To be fair, Wy's been modding here for more than two days.

Snow: I'm sorry you feel you've been mistreated here. But, honestly, I think you also might be reading a little too deeply into it. A little good-natured snark is good for morale, and it reveals that bit of personality and wit that can be so hard to impart by way of text.

Bear in mind, also, that, because this is a free forum, we attract the kind of spammers, trolls, moon-calves and assorted nitwits that rarely show up at a pay site. If the admins, mods, and even the senior members bring out the cudgels early, it's because we've all learned by hard experience that reasoned debate doesn't work on the agenda-driven, the stupid, and the insane. (Not saying, of course, that that's what you are.)

My advice, then--don't take it to heart if someone says something that bothers you. We don't start out looking to offend. Ever hear the old chestnut that, in speaking, the words we say make up only 10% of our message, and the tone and expression makes up the rest? Consider that you're only getting a fraction of the message before getting worked up about it.

[Snow]

Originally Posted by Wyborn

Thank you, ZeldaGirl, but I think he's not getting the point.

Snow, read this carefully.

First of all, I'm getting the impression that either English isn't your first language or you're not entirely familiar with several of the words you throw around ("audacious", "condescending", even "hindrance") because you just discovered them or you never bothered to learn how to use them properly in the first place, but it doesn't matter; if you value clarity of language so much, be more clear and concise when you speak. It will benefit you immensely when speaking to anyone here in the future, because the nuances of the language are extremely important to quite a few of us, especially me.

Secondly, I don't particularly care what other forums you go to on the internet, if any, and I most certainly don't care if they are "mostly comprised of adults with extremely advanced hobbies and interests", as little sense as it makes to put a qualitative modifier like "advanced" on something like a hobby or interest. In fact, I doubt that any of us do. You are still expected to remain on-topic within a given discussion, which you have failed to do twice now, falling into unabashed whining in the Majora's Mask topic and doing something very similar here, this time at a supermod. That is an immense no-no, especially given the tone of superiority you try to assume when talking to someone who actually has a measure of authority. More than that, you have no authority whatsoever to set down ground rules for how a moderator will talk to you. If mods at VGF had more power, you would be lucky if ZG didn't slap you with an infraction for taking that tone with her and bashing your head against the administrative wall. That, friend, is going to stop right here.

I'm not going to argue with you in this topic, or the Majora's Mask topic, about who is right or wrong in the argument that flared up there when I came on too strong with my opinion. The only discussion that will continue in that topic will be about Majora's Mask, as I have tried to steer the conversation back to three times now, and this is pretty much a fluff topic that's going to die off fairly quickly by its very nature. There will be no more arguing about this matter in public.

You have three courses of action you may take from this point on, because anything else is going to result in more trouble that could have been avoided.

1. You can drop this childish vendetta and become a contributing member of these forums. Everyone ends up happy. Hurray!

2. You can bring your complaint to me in a Private Message, where it will be discussed without cluttering the boards.

3. You can send complaints about me in Private Message to one or all of our three administrators, Saria Dragon, Heroine of the Dragon, or the big boss of the boards who's owned this place since it got started, Shane. They might take a while to get back to you, as they are immensely busy with their own personal lives and so forth, but you will get results in one form or another.

And that's it. There will be no more continuation of this little series of attacks in this topic or any other. Posts to that affect will be deleted and filed away for review by the administrators, especially since you've been given this warning.

We're not mean people, Snow. Hell, I'm not mean. You just took a disagreement way too personally and blew it way out of proportion. Can't we let misunderstandings lie, and try to get along and have a good time here?

First thank you again to Booyakasha, but I personally do not care and needn't help, I am leaving, and posted my concerns as a courtesy for the forum, not myself. I may write a good amount, but it is no trouble at all.

I bothered to do so because I was just stunned to find a forum would elect a common troll as a moderator. I think this is really rare especially for a board with so many members. I was even more shocked, perhaps amused to find, that you guys are serious. It seems there is an abnormal level of unawareness here and I think this above quote exemplifies exactly what I mean.

I'll run you through some basics here, it wont take much time. First paragraph is condescending, dedicated entirely to mocking me linguistically, wherein I have not erred. This is because Wyborn is easily threatened and needs to dismiss me and my far more advanced use of the English language.

Second paragraph, I really don't think I need to point out the boisterousness there. Again with more dismissal, and trying to back himself with authority and others rather than anything substantiated, before declaring this subject "not to be argued in public."

Finally he gives me my options in another power play, remember the goal here is to "win" and be "the man," so he must completely show that I am ignorant, alone, submissive to his authority, and whatever I do was permitted by him.

He cuts off any chance for any other word on it, as it will be censored, edited or deleted. And finally is the "good cop," the warm little conclusion wherein he acts as though he did not just call me ignorant, distort what I said, mock, belittle and power-trip (on a forum, which is sad in it's own right).

Anyway, I think there is a tendency to read emotionally here as well. When I say he is distorting, calling me names and mocking, I am not saying it in a sad, defeated or shaken way; I am saying it plainly, as fact, essentially I am reporting poor behavior and terrible customer service, and frankly I did not expect other forum employees to be so warm to such behavior.

With that I am out; and I will leave saying that I am awed by the way this forum treats its members, especially with basic and obvious concerns about a moderator. I will forward this to your administrator, and having been an admin myself, I cannot imagine this dismissive and condescending attitude permeates.

[The Doctor]

One question, how can Wy be considered as a troll, when he has been
A) A long time member here.
B) A previous mod of the zelda board (I think, can't remember)

Anyway, this topic has gotten way out of hand. Let's just say congrats to Wy and Boo, and go back to zelda.

[Booyakasha]

Snow, you've been warned. I have nothing personal against you, but you were asked to be reasonable and stay on-topic, and you ignored that request. I'd expect better from someone who claims to have been site administration.

Locked. Sorry, everyone; feel free to continue the actual topic in another thread.

[Saria Dragon of the Rain Wilds]

The topic is locked, but I want the last word...

...Congrats guys! It's been a long time coming that you're a mod, Boo, and it's great to have you back, Wy. And with the rebirth of HW, you might even drag some of the old Zelda forum crazies out of the innertubes. Hoorah!

*confetti*